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The First Year of IE7 | |
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| Time: 08:41 EST/13:41 GMT | News Source: Microsoft | Posted By: Kenneth van Surksum | ||
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It’s been a little over a year since we released IE7 on Windows XP and for Windows Vista, so I thought it would be worthwhile to talk about where we are after the year.
According to internal Microsoft research based on data from Visual Sciences Corporation, there are over 300 million users are experiencing the web with IE7. This makes IE7 the second most popular browser after IE6. IE7 is already #1 in the US and UK, and we expect IE7 to surpass IE6 worldwide shortly.
Perhaps more important than the overall numbers is the positive impact IE7 has made for our users. As you know, we focused a lot on improving security in IE7. We believe IE 7 is the safest Microsoft browser released to date. According to a vulnerability report published today, IE7 has fewer vulnerabilities than previous versions of IE over the same time period. What’s more, the report showed that IE7 had both fewer fixed and unfixed vulnerabilities in the first year than the other browsers we compared. | ||
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| #1 By 92460 (69.149.223.39) at 12/2/2007 3:03:56 PM |
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Oh, that use of IE7 is default.
It is STILL, after MS saying it wouldn't make it a 'critical update,' a critical update. When it is the only browser on your computer and it updates itself to the next version without your permission (becuase it is STILL a critical update) you use it because you have no choice. Can you report WHY and WHERE you got that data and the BASELINE for it with all details? W |
| #2 By 28801 (71.58.231.46) at 12/2/2007 3:31:29 PM |
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#1: I don't think that the "choice" argument holds much water these days except for grandma and grandpa who are completely non technical. Most large corporations control what browser their employees use. My company's default is still IE 6. I think these days more people have heard of FF than haven't.
This is a little off topic but is there a good solution for FF authentication with Active Directory besides keying all of your servers into "network.automatic-ntlm-auth.trusted-ruis"? |
| #3 By 15406 (99.224.112.94) at 12/2/2007 7:09:54 PM |
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#2: I think these days more people have heard of FF than haven't.
I think you're way off on that assumption. You can't allow yourself to believe that most people are like the average AW reader. We are, for the most part, the technical elite compared to the average user. I believe that your 'grandma.grandpa' are the average user. They know how to do what they do, but don't really pay too much attention at all to computing in general. It's not a hobby for them like it is for us. |
| #4 By 28801 (65.90.202.10) at 12/3/2007 7:10:40 AM |
| “Heard of” and “caring” are two different things. Many people have heard of alternate browsers, but as you assert, don't care or have no need of a skinned browser or a plug-in to stack tabs diagonally. |
| #5 By 17996 (131.107.0.105) at 12/3/2007 6:35:48 PM |
| #1 -- IE *never* "updates itself to the next version without your permission." Even if you have Automatic Updates set to automatically install updates, what that means for IE7 is that it downloads IE7 and then *offers* to install it. You can choose to accept or decline it. |
| #6 By 37 (76.210.78.134) at 12/4/2007 6:45:38 AM |
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" you use it because you have no choice."
The 90's called. That no longer holds water. There are numerous choices out there, and people are free to make those choices, and research. MS is no longer FORCING people to use their browser. |
| #7 By 12071 (124.168.186.163) at 12/4/2007 7:57:13 AM |
| #6 That argument is no longer valid because you and rxcall say it doesn't? I care to disagree. Latch is right - your average pc user running Windows isn't very likely to go find and install any other browser (and any user posting on this site is definitely outside the realms of "average"). They might have heard of Firefox, but they're completely unlikely to have heard of Opera or any of the other "choices" available. Where is your average user supposed to find this choice that you speak of given that they have an IE icon on their desktop and no way of uninstalling it? |
| #8 By 37 (76.210.78.134) at 12/4/2007 8:28:50 AM |
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Whoa whoa...analogy time here. So you mean to say, the consumer is unable to research for a better product on their own? I wonder how all these new Toyota buyers ended up leaving GM? Surely they didn't do some research and find out that there was a non-American vehicle out there that surpassed the big 3 vehicles in quality, reliability and pricing?
I am confident that the same "average" people buying computers are the same "average" people making the decision to research their automobiles. Microsoft has not locked anyone into anything. They are not preventing the "average" consumer from looking for a better OS, browser, or office suite. No way of uninstalling the IE? Does that mean that the consumer should be able to purchase windows, and then in the control panel, go to add/remove programs and uninstall themes, windows explorer, windows zip, windows cd burning, ms paint, network neighborhood, start button, notepad, wordpad. You can remove some windows components, however, it's not consumer friendly to do so. The Windows OS is ready "out of the box". How on god's green earth do you expect a consumer to get to the internet if IE isn't installed. Why should Microsoft be required to install a competing browser in it's OS? Why should MS be required to allow the consumer uninstall IE? Shouldn't they be required then to allow the consumer to remove every app, file, etc? I can't remove everything I want to remove in my new Mac or in my copy of Ubuntu. What's next? GM can't install their own choice of tires, engines, or radios? Will the government start forcing GM to put Ford engines in their cars if Ford starts doing poorly? Will the goverment require GM to install after market Alpine or Denon stereo's because GM's stereo's have improved so much that those companies are losing sales and could go out of business? It's a user experience out of the box, it's part of Microsoft profit/loss product cyle, and it's THEIR browser and OS that they "license" to the public to "use". Saying the public, average joe, cannot make a decision to not research an alternative browser or OS is just ludicrous at this day and age. And yes, it is no longer valid because I say it is no longer valid. |
| #9 By 13030 (198.22.121.110) at 12/4/2007 9:44:26 AM |
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More like bad analogy time. I don't understand the need for AWers to always want to use analogies.
#8: Saying the public, average joe, cannot make a decision to not research an alternative browser or OS is just ludicrous at this day and age. Considering the proliferation of viruses, spam, and social engineering e-mails and web sites, I believe the "average joe" to be much less sophisticated than you might think. (Yes, we are to blame for that.) Knowledge of hierarchical directories, account permissions, and network security settings are just barely on the radar of most folks. Software updates and installations have become one-click procedures and that is the limit of understanding for the "average joe". The typical PC user doesn't care about the technical details like we do. #8: Surely they didn't do some research and find out that there was a non-American vehicle out there that surpassed the big 3 vehicles in quality, reliability and pricing? Yeah, it's called a BMW. I've only owned one Japanese car (Nissan Pathfinder) and, while it's been a very good car, it's reliability has been no better than two previous Chevrolets. On the other hand, the BMW X5 I bought for my wife has been wonderful going on 5 years now. |
| #10 By 37 (76.210.78.134) at 12/4/2007 11:30:00 AM |
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Well, your opinion is duly noted. However, JD Power as well as consumer reports (and numerous other consumer surveys), and finally SALES have shown that consumers have switched from American made vehicles to imports. They did this because of research. There is only one reason Toyota has taken the number two spot in the United States ahead of Ford and Chrysler. Diminishing quality of American cars, poor perceptions of American reliability, and the consumers ability to choose and research. They have seen this on the news, word of mouth, and self interest research due to bad experiences. I currently own a 2007 Toyota Camry LE and 2006 Chevrolet Cobalt. I did my research, and I looked for the best cars that suited our needs, for the price, and looked at the reliability and safety of each. We have been happier with these purchases than our previous. As once a pro American gear head, I too realized (as most consumers obviously do), I have the ability to exercise my rights to research and choose which is best for me. Not Microsoft, not Mozilla, not GM nor Toyota is preventing me from choosing. Same goes for the average consumer.
No bad analogy here, just pointing out the facts. You hardly made the point that the consumer DOESN'T have a choice, when you know in fact, they do. Secondly, you didn't touch on the subject that we are discussing a need for an OS to have an internet browser for the average consumer, and why a company should be required to allow a small app to be removed, or a competing products app be preinstalled. Fact remains, the second that happens, all hell breaks loose. I dread the day I, as a business owner, am forced to compensate, advertise or promote a competitors product because they don't think it's "fair" that I am successful in my practice. Welcome to tyranny. BTW, the X5 is pretty sweet. I am really liking the new 1 Series coupe they are releasing here in the US. However, they priced it around the price of a 3 series from 10 years ago. This post was edited by AWBrian on Tuesday, December 04, 2007 at 12:11. |
| #11 By 28801 (65.90.202.10) at 12/4/2007 11:43:53 AM |
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#9: Name dropper. This post was edited by rxcall on Tuesday, December 04, 2007 at 11:46. |
| #12 By 13030 (198.22.121.110) at 12/4/2007 12:26:40 PM |
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#10: You hardly made the point that the consumer DOESN'T have a choice, when you know in fact, they do.
I never said anything about the consumer having a choice, other than an uniformed consumer may not realize they have a choice. I would suggest that the "average joe" doesn't even realize, or care, that there are alternatives to IE readily available. Secondly, you didn't touch on the subject that we are discussing a need for an OS to have an internet browser for the average consumer, and why a company should be required to allow a small app to be removed, or a competing products app be preinstalled. Personally, I don't think the browser belongs as an integrated part of the OS. I believe in simplicity and focus--"integrating" a bunch of end-user apps to an OS is a bad architectural idea. I dread the day I, as a business owner, am forced to compensate, advertise or promote a competitors product because they don't think it's "fair" that I am successful in my practice. I agree. ...the new 1 Series coupe... I didn't even know that existed. Hmmm... interesting, but not practical for a dad... #11: #9: Name dropper. Huh? |
| #13 By 92283 (142.32.208.232) at 12/4/2007 5:33:33 PM |
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#7 "given that they have an IE icon on their desktop"
I installed Ultimate from DVD. There is no IE icon on my desktop. Its on the Start Menu. You should try Vista. It might fool some people into thinking you know something. |
| #14 By 12071 (203.185.215.144) at 12/4/2007 9:39:51 PM |
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#8 I love bad analogy time here at AW... why we keep going to bad car analogies is getting old though given that just about everyone, on both sides of the fence, fairly much agrees that applying car analogies to computers just doesn't work.
1. "the consumer is unable to research for a better product on their own?" The consumer is able to research... however once a consumer has said product in their hands, as long as it is "good enough" (tm - Microsoft), they stop researching. And they stop researching until the point when said product breaks or gives them the sh*ts. This happens to apply to both cars and computers. In the case of Windows, since they already have a web browser they stop researching. Even though IE7 is a piece of sh*t from a developers point of view, to the average user it is "good enough". 2. "No way of uninstalling the IE?" Correct 3. "Does that mean that the consumer should be able to purchase windows, and then in the control panel, go to add/remove programs and uninstall themes, windows explorer, windows zip, windows cd burning, ms paint, network neighborhood, start button, notepad, wordpad." Why not? You were the one who mentioned choice (which I agree with). Why shouldn't they be given that choice? Why is your version of choice so limited? 4. "The Windows OS is ready "out of the box"" Please spare me the "wow", the OOBE, I have Vista, I know ALL about the OOBE and it's not pretty. 5. "How on god's green earth do you expect a consumer to get to the internet if IE isn't installed." IE != Internet, it's not the only way of getting on the "Internet" and people were getting on the Internet just fine in the 90's without having any web browser, ftp client, irc app hard-wired into their OS with no way of having it removed. 6. "Why should Microsoft be required to install a competing browser in it's OS?" They shouldn't. You brought up choice remember (I just agreed). If they don't want to give the user the choice of web browser then give them the choice of not having IE forced on them. Also, I hope that you're also old and intelligent enough to understand how a monopoly changes the rules here (because most others here have no clue whatsoever). Things work very differently in our supposed free market once a monopoly (or close enough to one) is created, leveraged and then exploited. 7. "Why should MS be required to allow the consumer uninstall IE?" Choice... remember? 8. "I can't remove everything I want to remove in my new Mac or in my copy of Ubuntu. " Why not? Because it stops working or do you not know how to? I run Ubuntu and there's not a single thing I cannot change about it if I should so choose to. 9. "What's next? GM can't install their own choice of tires, engines, or radios? ...... " Ok, perhaps I made the comment about you understanding monopolies a little too early. You wouldn't have thrown the usual "why can <company that doesn't not have anything close to a monopoly> do X but so and so can't?". I'm tired of having to explain why the rules for a monopoly are different and why they need to be that way to protect the consumer. If you're honestly interested in the reasons behind it Google is your friend. Heck, even Live Search should be able to point you to a few decent sites. 10. "And yes, it is no longer valid because I say it is no longer valid." Excellent, I disagree. #13 See if you weren't left behind like Mr Bush promised you'd learn to read and write and well, some basic comprehension. I do run Vista but the average user does not (hint: think XP). Once again thanks for proving you are completely out of tune with the average user. |
| #15 By 28801 (65.90.202.10) at 12/5/2007 7:06:24 AM |
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I would love to see Grandma start up her new PC, open up a command prompt, then ftp to the Firefox or Opera and download the browser of her choice.
"uninstall themes, windows explorer, windows zip, windows cd burning, ms paint, network neighborhood, start button, notepad, wordpad." STOP! Most of these are conveniences - bare bones apps that let users do the minimum. Most people download free or purchase superior versions of these apps. When was the last time you saw someone edit a photo in MS Paint? |
| #16 By 37 (76.210.78.134) at 12/5/2007 8:45:57 AM |
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#8 I love bad analogy time here at AW... why we keep going to bad car analogies is getting old though given that just about everyone, on both sides of the fence, fairly much agrees that applying car analogies to computers just doesn't work.
If you love a bad analogy, you came to the wrong place. 1. "the consumer is unable to research for a better product on their own?" The consumer is able to research... however once a consumer has said product in their hands, as long as it is "good enough" (tm - Microsoft), they stop researching. And they stop researching until the point when said product breaks or gives them the sh*ts. This happens to apply to both cars and computers. In the case of Windows, since they already have a web browser they stop researching. Even though IE7 is a piece of sh*t from a developers point of view, to the average user it is "good enough". 2. "No way of uninstalling the IE?" Correct It's Microsoft's product. They shouldn't be required to allow the install/uninstall of IE. The government shouldn't require them to do so either. The government already has too much control. It should be a "choice" that Microsoft is able to make. It should be a CHOICE for the consumer to choose to use a different browser. My car comes with a stereo STANDARD, and I have to pay for it no matter what. However, I can choose to use a different one, even though the one I have works "good enough". And if it does break, I can choose to use a different one down the road. 3. "Does that mean that the consumer should be able to purchase windows, and then in the control panel, go to add/remove programs and uninstall themes, windows explorer, windows zip, windows cd burning, ms paint, network neighborhood, start button, notepad, wordpad." Why not? You were the one who mentioned choice (which I agree with). Why shouldn't they be given that choice? Why is your version of choice so limited? Why not? It's Microsoft's product, that is why. They chose to have an OS with bundled services and LICENSE it users that VOLUNTARILY want to license the OS. However, they are still giving the consumer a choice to install any competing product they desire, and choose that product to be the default application. If the consumer wants a bare bones product, it's their choice to research the alternatives. 4. "The Windows OS is ready "out of the box"" Please spare me the "wow", the OOBE, I have Vista, I know ALL about the OOBE and it's not pretty. What are you talking about now? 5. "How on god's green earth do you expect a consumer to get to the internet if IE isn't installed." IE != Internet, it's not the only way of getting on the "Internet" and people were getting on the Internet just fine in the 90's without having any web browser, ftp client, irc app hard-wired into their OS with no way of having it removed. Hey mom, grandma and friends. Here is an OS for you to use to get on the internet. Have fun. BTW, there is no icon or web browser. Figure it out. 6. "Why should Microsoft be required to install a competing browser in it's OS?" They shouldn't. You brought up choice remember (I just agreed). If they don't want to give the user the choice of web browser then give them the choice of not having IE forced on them. Also, I hope that you're also old and intelligent enough to understand how a monopoly changes the rules here (because most others here have no clue whatsoever). Things work very differently in our supposed free market once a monopoly (or close enough to one) is created, leveraged and then exploited. This post was edited by AWBrian on Wednesday, December 05, 2007 at 08:48. |
| #17 By 37 (76.210.78.134) at 12/5/2007 8:47:22 AM |
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They do have a choice. They don't have to use IE. It's not forced on them. It's an option, and it's a good idea to include a web browser, and why not their own? I sure as heck would prefer someone to use my browser if I created one for an OS that I created. BTW, just because the definition of monopoly is out there, and Microsoft is labeled as one (and supposedly abusing their monopoly powers), doesn't mean I agree (and others) that a monopoly is something that is always negative, or that every aspect of MS's monopoly is abused. If I could have a monopoly in the town I live in (we own a UPS Store), I would not only be a monopoly, I would take advantage of that the best I could. And at the same time, give my customers great service.
7. "Why should MS be required to allow the consumer uninstall IE?" Choice... remember? Yup. And Microsoft should have the choice to have their browser bundled in their OS. At the same time, they are giving the consumer a choice to use a different browser (or OS for that matter) 8. "I can't remove everything I want to remove in my new Mac or in my copy of Ubuntu. " Why not? Because it stops working or do you not know how to? I run Ubuntu and there's not a single thing I cannot change about it if I should so choose to. Because it's not consumer friendly, and in any OS scenario, unless you are a more knowledgeable computer user, you will break the OS, including Ubuntu. 9. "What's next? GM can't install their own choice of tires, engines, or radios? ...... " Ok, perhaps I made the comment about you understanding monopolies a little too early. You wouldn't have thrown the usual "why can <company that doesn't not have anything close to a monopoly> do X but so and so can't?". I'm tired of having to explain why the rules for a monopoly are different and why they need to be that way to protect the consumer. If you're honestly interested in the reasons behind it Google is your friend. Heck, even Live Search should be able to point you to a few decent sites. So, you are telling me that GM (or the big 3) didn't monopolize the US in car manufacturing prior to the 90s? You best polish up on your automotive history. You can explain the "rules" of a monopoly until you run out of breath, but for some, they don't agree with the terminology, or at least the enforcement of such a practice. I concur that the consumer needs to be protected, but I also believe businesses need to be protected as well, especially from unnecessary government intervention. I have no need to Google, as I am well versed in the monopoly aspects of busniess, and I am a business owner myself. I have plenty of experience. Maybe it's you that should check out the friendly Google. 10. "And yes, it is no longer valid because I say it is no longer valid." Excellent, I disagree. Ok. Welcome to the free world where AWIN resides, USA #13 See if you weren't left behind like Mr Bush promised you'd learn to read and write and well, some basic comprehension. I do run Vista but the average user does not (hint: think XP). Once again thanks for proving you are completely out of tune with the average user. So, just because you lose an argument, you must resort to insults? Pathetic. Don't bother replying unless you can offer a mature debate. This post was edited by AWBrian on Wednesday, December 05, 2007 at 08:56. |
| #18 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 12/5/2007 11:47:20 AM |
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#16: It's Microsoft's product. They shouldn't be required to allow the install/uninstall of IE. The government shouldn't require them to do so either. The government already has too much control. It should be a "choice" that Microsoft is able to make. It should be a CHOICE for the consumer to choose to use a different browser. My car comes with a stereo STANDARD, and I have to pay for it no matter what. However, I can choose to use a different one, even though the one I have works "good enough". And if it does break, I can choose to use a different one down the road.
To continue the bad automotive analogy, this would be the equivalent of GM not allowing you to remove the old pre-installed radio, and forcing you to fasten a new one to the dashboard, and connect to the speakers and antenna in parallel, forcing the old radio to remain fully functional. This is the automotive equivalent to allowing any browser to be installed, but forbidding IE from being uninstalled. So, in fact, GM (and all other car makers) give you the OPTION to remove the old radio, and replace it with whatever make and model you prefer. Microsoft does not give you this option. |
| #19 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 12/5/2007 11:49:30 AM |
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#17: So, just because you lose an argument, you must resort to insults? Pathetic. Don't bother replying unless you can offer a mature debate.
Just to clarify, does that also apply to Parkkker, who was the first to offer an insult instead of a mature comment? |
| #20 By 28801 (65.90.202.10) at 12/5/2007 1:07:43 PM |
| #19: Can't you read Sentinel? That was not Parker! |
| #21 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 12/5/2007 1:36:08 PM |
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#20: Who can't read? To quote:
Chris_Kabuki: #13 See if you weren't left behind like Mr Bush promised you'd learn to read and write and well, some basic comprehension. I do run Vista but the average user does not (hint: think XP). Once again thanks for proving you are completely out of tune with the average user. AWBrian: So, just because you lose an argument, you must resort to insults? Pathetic. Don't bother replying unless you can offer a mature debate. Check #13 again. It is NotParkerToo. AKA, Parkkker. |
| #22 By 28801 (65.90.202.10) at 12/5/2007 2:41:35 PM |
| #21: It was a JOKE! |
| #23 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 12/5/2007 2:50:17 PM |
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#22: Sorry. I completely misunderstood. My bad.
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| #24 By 37 (66.188.104.250) at 12/5/2007 7:05:43 PM |
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To continue the bad automotive analogy, this would be the equivalent of GM not allowing you to remove the old pre-installed radio, and forcing you to fasten a new one to the dashboard, and connect to the speakers and antenna in parallel, forcing the old radio to remain fully functional. This is the automotive equivalent to allowing any browser to be installed, but forbidding IE from being uninstalled. So, in fact, GM (and all other car makers) give you the OPTION to remove the old radio, and replace it with whatever make and model you prefer. Microsoft does not give you this option.
It's only a bad analogy if you don't comprehend the relation. GM is NOT giving you the option to remove their stereos any longer. They have integrated the airbag wiring with the stereos now. This means, if you pull their factory stereos out, you disable the airbags in the vehicles. One has to purchase a new stereo, along with a new wiring harness to bypass this problem. Installers are avoiding lawsuits by turning down such installations on these new cars. Microsoft gives you the option to use another browser. There is no need to remove the other browser. Where as in the GM vehicle, there is only one spot. With MS, out of site out of mind. 15mb file. So what it comes down to, is that people are freaking out about MS being an monopoly because they won't let you remove a 15mb file/application. We all agree that nobody has to use the file. We can all agree that it takes up negligible space on a 250gb - 1tb HDD, we can download and install any alternative browser we desire, we can (as does the general public) research alternatives to our browser that we use on Windows. So, it boils down to people complaining about the inability to remove a 15mb file from an OS created by the same people that bundled said app/file, and "licensed" it to users to "voluntarily" use. Wow...and to think, I thought we had problems in Iraq. sigh |
| #25 By 37 (66.188.104.250) at 12/5/2007 7:11:52 PM |
| And the funny thing about this conversation, I choose NOT to use Windows or IE (obviously) any longer. |
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