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Microsoft and Linspire Collaboration Promotes Interoperability and Customer Choice

Time: 09:10 EST/14:10 GMT | News Source: Press Release | Posted By: Michael Dragone

Today Microsoft Corp. and Linux desktop provider Linspire Inc. announced a broad interoperability, technical collaboration that also includes intellectual property assurances. The agreement promotes customer choice and strengthens the bridge between the Microsoft� Windows� and Linux operating systems.

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#1 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 6/14/2007 9:29:26 AM

Once again, I say that interop is real - and always has been [for a great many Microsoft centric shops, devs and engineers that have focused on customer needs, first] - it is just getting easier now - and isn't cooperation, joint work, and getting along a lot better than litigation and overly-hyped press? Isn't a world where all benefit what was wanted?

#2 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 6/14/2007 9:50:06 AM

This deal is different from their other ones in that Linspire is actually licensing real IP, and not just falling victim to MS' nebulous patent claims & protection racket. It actually appears to be legit. More power to them. I have no problem with MS seeking to license its legitimate IP, and no problems with a Linux vendor that wants to license it.

Edit: My bad. There's that nasty term in there again: Patent Covenant. I wonder how much MS pays these people to acquiesce to their patent FUD? Whatever. These smaller Linux players have to do what they have to do to stay afloat and get some press (even if bad). Good thing Canonical and Red Hat are still above being bought (for now).

This post was edited by Latch on Thursday, June 14, 2007 at 09:55.

#3 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 6/14/2007 10:22:21 AM

MS: We are sincere about interop between our software and all other software
OSS: Really?
MS: Yeah, here are the deal points.
OSS: Reasonable - okay, we're in.
MS: Us, too.
OSS: Whew.
MS:Let's move forward and see what we can do together.
OSS: Cool, about time, huh?
MS: Yeah, sure is.

LATCH: Whoa... ya'll knock that crap off and start fighting again - some of us were making a decent living keeping score.

OSS: Shuddup, Latch.
MS: Hey, OSS, did you see what we added for you in support for printers?
OSS: Bitch'in Cool.

#4 By 32132 (142.32.208.234) at 6/14/2007 10:42:51 AM

Latch's View: Anyone who believes Microsofts FUD and signs a deal are morons.

Reality: Latch is a moron.

#5 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 6/14/2007 10:57:31 AM

#3: Why do you deliberately persist in misrepresenting my position? I know you're not too dumb to understand, so it must be willful. Plus, you seem to have a fundamental deficiency in your understanding of open source software and the community. Xandros, SUSE, Lindows != FOSS. The former are companies, the latter has been variously described as a movement or a method. The FOSS community has pretty much spoken out in unison against these FUD deals, so your weak attempt at humour is pretty much grounded in fantasy land. You forgot the part where MS announces that the new partner has bowed to the FUDdy patent claims and their new partner says "Hey, we never agreed to that", which means MS is either shafting their partners (pretty much the default assumption, if history is anything to go by), or the partner is playing their part in a deceptive game of "BS the FOSS Community". And, as has been pointed out many many times, MS isn't exactly known for its desire to help others. That's just the siren song to lure you in until you're in their embrace. If MS is so into helping others and interoperating, perhaps they could open up their document formats? Perhaps they could support ODF instead of one-way plugins? There are lots of real, visible ways that MS could help the interoperability problem without apologists spinning their tactical moves as being in everyone's best interests.

#6 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 6/14/2007 11:19:34 AM

#5, "The Community?" ?!?!? is such an amorphous entity that as it evolves its shelves anything suggesting continuity in favor of ever changing arguments - there are a couple of things that are clear: universally, there is too little consistency and too many factions - FOSS/OSS is the digital equivalent of a region populated with tribes hostile to one another. If any thing is consistent, it is that the relationships with Microsoft are providing unity and a chance to build a consistent model - ironically, using and centered on Microsoft's IP [the original unifier of most things "development" and most things "hardware"].

A heck of a lot more good is coming out of these deals than bad - again, for anyone interested in true interop.

"MS isn't exactly known for its desire to help others." Well, its leaders sure seem to be - after all, they have committed to giving away all they have earned to those in need. That kind of example doesn't just sit there and not motivate others and dang, I don't know that I could as much more of the partner program.

Finally, breathe in and out man... some posts are intended to present as much humor as they are one's perspectives.

#7 By 3653 (68.52.143.149) at 6/14/2007 2:01:01 PM

So, 2 of my comments were deleted without the customary "Deleted by Activewin for breaking the rules" statement.

One here, and one on the "activewin down at noon" post.

#8 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 6/14/2007 2:03:19 PM

#7, What were they?

#9 By 32132 (66.183.202.89) at 6/15/2007 12:06:11 AM

"or the partner is playing their part in a deceptive game of "BS the FOSS Community". "

Well, the FOSS "community" is full of hate-filled wackos who made all kind of horrible threats and attacks against Migual Icaza and anyone associated with Novell.

It is in their best interest to lie to avoid that kind of hate. However, in this case, they opted for the truth:

"Intellectual Property Assurance
Through the agreement, Microsoft and Linspire have developed a framework to provide patent covenants for Linspire customers. The patent covenants provide customers with confidence that the Linspire technologies they use come with rights to relevant Microsoft patents. As well, Linspire now joins a growing group of open source software (OSS) distributors collaborating with Microsoft on efforts to establish rich interoperability, deliver IP assurance to customers and build the bridge between open source and proprietary software.

For Microsoft, the agreement is the latest in a series of collaborations with Linux platform and OSS providers. This list of collaborators includes JBoss, LG Electronics, Novell, Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd., Xandros Inc., XenSource Inc. and Zend Technologies Inc."

http://www.linspire.com/lindows_news_pressreleases.php

#10 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 6/15/2007 8:44:57 AM

Interesting analysis of this deal:

A little perspective here, please.

* Novell sold out because, despite their purchases of Ximian & SuSE, they never really "got" Linux; they were just trying to shore up a rapidly dying Netware product while continuing business along the same paradigms that killed it. Witness the resulting exodus of several core SUSE developers, further reducing the company's understanding of Linux; frankly I've seen Novell Linux brands as almost defunct for some years now. (go on, flame away...)

* Xandros sold out because their market share and community was miniscule. They sought to steal Windows market share, but (unsurprisingly) didn't have the resource to tackle Redmond. Xandros are already defunct and starting to smell; they just don't know it yet. (go on, flame some more...)

* Linspire haven't really recovered since having their teeth pulled, and they really don't "get" the security issue. The whole distro is very much Kevin Carmony's baby, and seems to be very fluid while it tries to find a profitable niche. Ubuntu's just broken into the territory it was trying to win (i.e. preinstalled mainstream linux), so I think the distro will die soon. Strangely, though, I don't think that Linspire has sold out, exactly, it's following in its father's footsteps; it understands business, not OS, and is evolving into a kind of "software accessibility enabler". Personally I detest the proprietary shit its peddling, but Ubuntu's already proven there's a demand for that.

So MS has munched on the low-hanging fruit. Sad, but not unexpected; the old & weak are always the first to go in war & business. What remains is :

* Several hundred non-commercial distros, top of the list is Debian, the epitome of idealism.
* Ubuntu - very smart, idealistic, breaking into the mainstream.
* Redhat - very smart, idealistic, pwns the enterprise Linux sector and employs the majority of kernel hackers (and just ballsed up royally with its recent partnership - *Symantec*, for gods' sake! - but they should weather it ok).
* Mandriva - still kicking, playing interesting tunes on 3D desktop usability.
* Various other commercial appliance distros e.g. firewalls, Tivo, etc.
* One lone idealistic guy with who owns the damn trademark.

So let's not moan doom & gloom too early, eh?

Now, if someone rings tomorrow to tell me that Torvalds just sold Linux(tm), then you might have a point. But the *source* will still be out there & owned by the community that developed it. There is now a minimum level of code & application quality that proprietary software houses must meet; and while they don't, there will always be an underdog.

#11 By 32132 (66.183.202.89) at 6/15/2007 9:07:56 AM

Latch hates anyone who collaborates with the Great Satan. Ho hum.

#12 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 6/15/2007 9:18:10 AM

Yeah, but if Linspire [if I read him right] were picked by Dell over Ubuntu, he'd stil hate it, but advocate for it and list it amongst the fruit resting higher up in the tree. I haven't reconciled that one yet.

#13 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 6/15/2007 12:19:09 PM

#12: Bzzzt, wrong again, but then that's to be expected. I will not advocate any distro that chooses to directly or indirectly validate MS FUD by signing a patent covenant with MS. As I've said a zillion times before, if MS has a valid claim for their IP being improperly included in Linux then let it be known. The offenders can then either license the code or remove it. That's how it's done in the real world. When you find someone violating your assets, you want to to either stop or pay to continue. MS doesn't seem to want either outcome for some bizarre reason that nobody can figure out. Oh wait, we did figure it out -- FUD. Make scary, ambiguous claims and then do nothing to clear up the confusion, and try to keep it going for as long as possible (just like the FUDdy SCO case being waged by MS via proxy SCO.) Classic FUD. You can't deny that, no matter how hard you spin.

#14 By 3653 (68.52.143.149) at 6/15/2007 2:31:00 PM

latch - "That's how it's done in the real world. When you find someone violating your assets, you want to to either stop or pay to continue."

I suggest you pay better attention to how this USUALLY happens. In a typical scenario, the patent holder gets several licensees on board. That helps validate the patent, in a non-legal way. THEN, they use those signed licenses as further proof, to leverage for yet more licenses.

Don't get too far ahead of the timeline.

#15 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 6/18/2007 8:13:31 AM

#14: That helps validate the patent, in a non-legal way.

Do you even read what you write? That's the stupidest statement I've read all month.

#16 By 4240821 (213.139.195.162) at 10/27/2023 4:23:55 AM