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Microsoft's Role Leads Countries to Seek Alternative, NYT Says | |
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| Time: 12:08 EST/17:08 GMT | News Source: Bloomberg | Posted By: Byron Hinson | ||
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Microsoft Corp.'s position as the world's biggest software maker led governments in Europe, Asia and Latin America to encourage their various agencies to use alternatives to its products, the New York Times said, citing industry experts. The governments are promoting switching to ``open source'' software like Linux, which is distributed free by programmers, the paper said. International Business Machines Corp., the world's biggest computer maker, is working on Linux-based projects with many governments, the paper said. | ||
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| #1 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 9/5/2002 2:59:03 PM |
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Bonor, maybe people will stop when the softies, AND MS themselves, stop saying their is no economic incentive in OS, that OS puts people out of work, that it demoralizes capitalism, that business cannot make money off of OS software, etc, etc, etc...
You can't have it both ways, but I see you fail to say: "Microsoft tries to equate OS as being a bad thing." |
| #2 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 9/5/2002 3:17:41 PM |
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stu, do you realize how stupid it is to say you can't make money, but then to admit that IBM, BEA, Borland, HP, Red Hat, Apple, Sun, and many others are all providing some form of OS software and/or related services and making money off of it?
There is no reality to this senseless claim. Whereas, the gripe that bonor is making doesn't hold that much water--large corporations will have service contracts and consultants whether they use OS or Windows. (Particularly if you consider that the info and support these consultants will provide is freely and openly available in the OS community.) The question is do you want to pay $500 for every desktop and maybe several thousand for every server when you can completely eliminate the cost. |
| #3 By 135 (209.180.28.6) at 9/5/2002 3:18:04 PM |
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Obviously the point is to compare apples to apples.
Linux is only free if your time is without value. |
| #4 By 135 (209.180.28.6) at 9/5/2002 3:19:09 PM |
| sodajerk - Redhat isn't a profitable company. IBM, BEA, Borland, HP, Apple and Sun aren't making money off of OSS. |
| #5 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 9/5/2002 3:23:09 PM |
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soda, how can you suggest that aren't making money off of it. They are saving R&D costs. They are charging for services related to OS. They are charging for hardware with OS software. They are charging for distributions of OS packages. They are gaining benefits by contributing to the community, and the community giving back. They are saving the cost of working with MS. Etc, etc, etc...
"Linux is only free if your time is without value." Since when is Wintel a zero-maintenance, zero-servicing, 100% non-time consuming choice that never has any problems, errors, limitations in its programming, bugs, viruses, etc...? |
| #6 By 135 (209.180.28.6) at 9/5/2002 6:14:47 PM |
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jerky boy - Where are the sales figures showing the extra sales generated as a result of open source?
Not sure what MS has to do with this. If you look at these companies they are essentially competing with their other lines of business, not Microsoft. So they rob peter to pay paul... decrease Solaris sales, increase Qube sales... decreased AIX sales, increased Linux sales. Anyway, just think maybe you should provide a compelling argument instead of this wishful thinking crap. "Since when is Wintel a zero-maintenance" Who said anything about Wintel? We're talking Linux. Nice try to deflect the issue. bluesky - No, they are spending money related to OSS. To make money implies they are generating a profit. As we know Redhat is not profitable, and these other companies are only profitable in their other lines of business. I do think IBM has the right idea, to some degree, if they didn't adapt Linux they would become irrelevant like Sun. But it's not generating them extra profit margins. This post was edited by sodablue on Thursday, September 05, 2002 at 18:16. |
| #7 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 9/5/2002 6:42:02 PM |
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Extra sales? Who needs to show that? They should be bleeding money right now by dedicating billions of dollars of resources to something that can't possibly generate revenue, right? So where are the steep declines in the balance sheets? They had the strategy for over a year now--where's the loss?
Who said they were stealing sales from anyone--whether it replaces internal efforts, supplements them, or takes business from competitors... it doesn't matter--my only point is that they can successfully make money using OS software in their business strategy. You said it's not an apples to orange comparison because of the time lost--what time? You have to do the same servicing, maintenance, etc of Windows systems. Or are you suggesting that someone sitting at a Linux workstation accomplishes zero work in an eight hour day? Who's fooling themselves with wishful thinking now. Why would it have to be a greater profit margin, soda, for it to count? Isn't a profit a profit. Why don't you show me the loss being generated from the expenditures on OS. |
| #8 By 1845 (12.254.162.111) at 9/5/2002 6:45:04 PM |
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sodablue, I think IBM has another motivation in supporting Linux, namely to curb Microsoft's power in the industry. In like manner, I believe this is why they support Java. IBM certainly could have become the premier Windows server vendor for high end boxes (as Unisys is) or mid range (as Compaq mostly was). They could have developed quite a happy app server for Windows based on COM or .NET, but they chose Java.
If I remeber correctly, more than half of IBM's revenue comes from licensing of their intellectual property. I'd like to know how profitable (if indeed they are profitable) are IBM's Linux related business units. |
| #9 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 9/5/2002 6:52:17 PM |
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uh, Bob, IBM has never wanted to and no one would have suggested they become a high end or middle tier lacky to Microsoft. Enterprises go to IBM for their technology and services, not MS's.
Why didn't they choose .Net? Oh yeah, that .Net Framework for mainframes flies off the shelf so fast it's invisible. |
| #10 By 5444 (208.180.245.190) at 9/6/2002 2:03:34 AM |
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Davis.
Unfortantly it won't be. In the long run it will cost more. or about the same as it does now. Perhaps only a the licensing fees will drop some what. But I do agree with the last statement, the up front cost for the base OS and hardware will be cheaper. Although the Support for the software will not be. you still need to get a DB software for example. and so far there isn't any good OS DB software that is worth its wait in a secure setup a government would need. MySQL doesn't support Unicode and quite a few languages. Postgres is better but still needs some performance enhancements. So that leaves you with any of the big 3 database group. since you are in Linux that automatically eliminates one. At the desktop level. I can see where the saving will really come in though. Except most of the software would have to be retooled for a unix based systerm. And tha tis beyond Office type applications. el |
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