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MS/Apple: Can this marriage be saved? (I doubt it) | |
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| Time: 02:37 EST/07:37 GMT | News Source: ZDNet | Posted By: Byron Hinson | ||
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For the life of me, I can't explain why otherwise apparently normal men and women would line up for a quarter-mile or so to see a keynote at a computer show. I've been to lots of these speeches, and have never seen anything worth standing in line for. But this is Macworld, and there are lots of things Mac that can't be understood by outsiders. What the true believers got in return for their fealty was a nearly two-hour-long product pitch, in which Apple CEO Steve Jobs introduced some new iPods (including a Windows model), some new software, and pitched his new operating system, OS X 10.2, due in stores Aug. 24. And there was .Mac, which Steve called "Web services for the rest of us." (Actually, it's more like "Web services from a company with no enterprise strategy.") Only brief mention was given to the new 17-inch iMac, a steal at $1,999. | ||
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| #1 By 7390 (63.211.44.114) at 7/19/2002 7:09:34 AM |
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"Only brief mention was given to the new 17-inch iMac, a steal at $1,999. "
and thus lies one of Apple's problems: I recently bought a 17' flat panel 2.26 ghz machine from dell $1500 tons of ram, great video, 120 gig drive. And I still think that I over paid. Apple cannot compete based upon price and performance. But that 20 gig Ipod does sound great. |
| #2 By 7711 (209.66.43.131) at 7/19/2002 7:41:23 AM |
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Win98SE..a rip off set of bug fixes
WinME...even more so WinXP...similar to 98SE BUT...OS X 10.2...the greatest thing since sliced bread, and only $120. Why not the similar level of outrage and vitriol against Apple ripping off their customers for a glorified bug fix of a much delayed and hyped OS? Oh yeah, I forgot....a) It's Apple and they can do no wrong. b) They're already used to getting ripped off and liking it (see #1). Although I agree...the new Windows ipods look awesome...got to wait till late Aug though. I may (shudder) actually buy (second shudder) an Apple product. |
| #3 By 1845 (12.254.162.111) at 7/19/2002 8:28:07 AM |
| 98SE did, contratry to popular belief have new functionality. With XP coming so soon, I don't think ME was worth doing. XP is certainly worth the upgrade, especially from 9x. |
| #4 By 135 (209.180.28.6) at 7/19/2002 10:51:22 AM |
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jimlat - WinXP is not similar to 98SE. It's more like the diff of Win98 over Win95.
Oh yeah, and I'm all excited about Apple charging $120 for a service pack! |
| #5 By 3653 (63.162.177.140) at 7/19/2002 11:21:14 AM |
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I just don't understand the fascination with the iPod. Compare it to the Archos Jukebox 20 (Same amount of storage, better Windows compatibility, and 40% cheaper price) ( http://www.archos.com/us/products/product_jbplayers.html ). And please don't reply about the iPod having Firewire support. The Archos has USB2, which is faster than Firewire.
And here's a feature the iPod can't touch... the ability to RECORD from non-computer devices like your stereo, cassette, 8-track, line-in ( http://www.archos.com/us/products/product_jbrecorders.html ) Oh, and did I forget to mention that these players can also operate as full hard disks. You want to move a Word doc? No problem. Please note: I do not work for Archos, but I also don't blindly buy Apple-branded products. This post was edited by mooresa56 on Friday, July 19, 2002 at 11:23. |
| #6 By 135 (209.180.28.6) at 7/19/2002 2:03:49 PM |
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I was considering a portable harddrive. So I could transfer files from home to work, etc. I could care less about it being an MP3 player, even though most of the files I have on the drive are music(but I play through my desktop). I looked at various solutions and eventually just came up with buying some removable drive bays and using an old 30 Gig drive.
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| #7 By 2960 (68.100.19.3) at 7/19/2002 5:16:01 PM |
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#2,
The iMac also includes a DVD Burner, and the LCD on the iMac is a Landcape model that's a bit bigger. 1440 X 960 or something like that. TL |
| #8 By 2960 (68.100.19.3) at 7/19/2002 5:19:51 PM |
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#2,
You may add me to the outrage group. Steve Jobs is out of his friggin' mind. He expects me to spend $130 on a point-release OS a mere 3 months after buying a machine? MacOS X is a lot better than you give it credit for, but this is insanity. I'm also pissed about QuickTime 6 and it's NO UPGRADE policy. I paid for QT5 less than 5 weeks ago, and they want me to pay full price. I'll let them simmer until they come to their senses. I think the MacOS X thing is going to change. The Mac community outcry over the 10.2 non-upgrade situation is monumental, and is about the biggest outcry I've ever seen come from the Mac Community. I predict a $69 + S/H upgrade will be announced eventually. PLEASE - THIS IS NOT A RUMOR. It is only my crystal ball. TL |
| #9 By 2960 (68.100.19.3) at 7/19/2002 5:21:54 PM |
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#5,
It's obvious you've never actually used an iPod, or you would understand. As for USB2 vs. Firewire, USB2 is faster on PAPER. Most of the comparison's I've read on the web show that FireWire is more consistent, and it's also not as hard on the CPU. In the end, it averages out a bit faster tuan USB2. Not to mention that FireWire 2 is going to be here in a few months. TL |
| #10 By 7711 (208.9.144.58) at 7/19/2002 5:23:13 PM |
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Soda..
I meant the comments made by anti-MS types. Many said that 98SE was a rip-off of bug fixes that should have been free. XP some criticize as a minor fix of Win2K. I personally love XP having upgraded my A21m Thinkpad from 2K to XP pro. Larry (#10) understood what I was trying to say. My point is that I have yet to see the same comments and outrage on the incremental (10.0 vs 10.2) fixes for OSX costing $125. I wasn't commenting on MS, but on the Apple "Jobs is God, Apple is perfect and all is good" mentality. Style over substance from Apple as usual. |
| #11 By 3653 (63.162.177.140) at 7/19/2002 6:18:58 PM |
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techlarry,
You are "obviously" incorrect. I had an iPod in my hand less than 48 hours ago. USB2 slower than FireWire? Could you please supply a link. My mind will stay open that long, I think. Firewire2? Oh, the future always looks so bright in the merry mac world. Always selling tomorrow... WHO CARES ABOUT v.2. We are talking about the iPod TODAY. I could care less if the iMac runs at 17GHz in the future. We are discussing the here and now. The reality of the mac market looks terrible. I can't remember a more miserable set of announcements at a MacWorld. A 17" monitor? Woo-hoo! Those became available to the rest of the world over 2 years ago. And this business about charging for iTools and OS 10.2 is hillarious. Just when you thought Steve Jobs might tire from sodomizing his Mac users, he catches a second wind and begins to pump even harder. |
| #12 By 2960 (68.100.19.3) at 7/19/2002 8:20:42 PM |
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Jim,
I think Stevie Boy has a few dings in his armor over this one. I've never seen such anger out of the Mac community, overall, as I have with this MacOS X 10.2 thing. I can't help but think it's going to change. Apple has backed down before when something like this has happened, and this is FAR more serious than anything I've ever seen before. TL |
| #13 By 2960 (68.100.19.3) at 7/19/2002 8:24:09 PM |
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#13,
I didn't say it was slower. I said it was _less consistent_, and FireWire, overall. FireWire remains the connectivity of choice for high-performance applications. I'm not going to do your research for you. You can do the same thing I did, and go out and look through the web for articles that have tested this. No other portable MP3 player has the design or engineering of the iPod. Nothing is smaller. Nothing has a more useable interface. NOTHING is faster at populating it's hard drive. To the best of my knowledge, there are no USB 2.0 MP3 players, though I could be wrong. This leaves you with USB 1.1. Do you have any idea how long it would take to fill a 10 or 20GB hard drive with that interface? It will be a moot point in about 2 months anyway. TL |
| #14 By 2960 (68.100.19.3) at 7/19/2002 8:30:46 PM |
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#15,
Geez, talk abour PC evangilism! Is Steve Jobs out of his mind with the MacOS X pricing? Yes. Has he pissed off me, and tons other Mac users with this and the QuickTime 6 non-upgrade policy? Yes. Do I think Apple needs to drop-kick Motorola and engineer Athlon's into the Mac? Yes (and I accept the heat I'll take for that willingly). But burn in Hell? Mac's are nice machines and for certain functions they simply cannot be beat. That's why I have one incorporated into my home network, along with 2 Win2K Servers, a Win2K Laptop, and a WinXP Desktop. I use each according to it's merits because each HAS merits. I will also bitch about whoever is not treating me the way I want to be treated as a customer. It's usually Microsoft, for good reason, but today it's Apple. In fact Microsoft was sort of a Hero this week. The release of the TS/RDC client absolutely astonished me and pleased me at the same time. In short, don't get your drawers in such a bunch :) TL |
| #15 By 3653 (65.190.70.73) at 7/20/2002 12:24:02 AM |
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TechLarry,
Re: Firewire being faster than USB2 - It takes a big man to back down so quickly. Nice job. ----- "To the best of my knowledge, there are no USB 2.0 MP3 players, though I could be wrong. This leaves you with USB 1.1." You responded to my first post, but apparently didn't follow any of the links or read it very well. BOTH of the Archos mp3 players that I discussed use USB 2.0, not USB 1.1 Here are the links again for your convenience. http://www.archos.com/us/products/product_jbplayers.html http://www.archos.com/us/products/product_jbrecorders.html |
| #16 By 135 (208.50.201.48) at 7/20/2002 2:00:15 AM |
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Apple's recent moves have served to remind me why I never bought a Macintosh. The company has always overcharged for their products, right from the Apple II days.
TechLarry - Heh. The Remote Desktop Client for the Mac violates the EULA for Windows XP. That's pretty funny! But it's nice to see that now Mac users can use a real OS, even if it is remotely. :) |
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