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Windows XP to be phased out by year's end despite customer demand | |
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| Time: 02:52 EST/07:52 GMT | News Source: APC Mag | Posted By: Kenneth van Surksum | ||
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Computer makers have been told they'll no longer be able to get Windows XP OEM by the end of this year, despite consumer resistance to Vista and its compatibility problems. By early 2008, Microsoft's contracts with computer makers will require companies to only sell Vista-loaded machines. "The OEM version of XP Professional goes next January," said Frank Luburic, senior ThinkPad product manager for Lenovo. "At that point, they'll have no choice." Despite Microsoft's relentless promotion of Vista, manufacturers are still seeing plenty of demand from customers for systems preloaded with XP, especially in the finicky SOHO market. | ||
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| #26 By 2201 (81.107.201.78) at 4/12/2007 1:31:15 PM |
| #23 but I don't see why they should have to. At the end of the day it's a business decision, not something that will kill thousands of people. If people want to get XP on their machine, they can do some other way, but businesses can't support products for ever. There will always be people who will be hurt by this but that's progress. |
| #27 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 4/12/2007 1:32:27 PM |
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#25: Sorry, I made a mistake. And unlike a lot of people here, I can admit it. If I wanted to fit in better here, I would just go away silently and then make the same mistake tomorrow. This post was edited by Latch on Thursday, April 12, 2007 at 13:37. |
| #28 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 4/12/2007 2:01:02 PM |
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How can anyone credibly opine regarding Windows Vista, if they have not used it fully and over a period of time. Similarly, how can such comments be regarded with any validity in any context outside of the perspective of a single, lay end user, if one's experience is equally limited?
To do so reflects dogma - the most appropriate definition of arrogance - beliefs held out as fact without the benefit of any form of evidence. To use any other form of argument to counter Latch's present statements is like yelling at a rock - he has no basis from which to understand any counter arguments being presented. He's decided without sufficient experience, that Windows Vista is a bad product. That's fine and all are welcome to decide similarly - we simply have to take this into consideration when responding. Countering such dogma is appropriate, as many people come here to learn more about what is going on regarding Microsoft software. I hope that they take one message away from their exposure here - that if they want a great computing experience, Windows Vista is a good choice and worth the investment in time, money and energy needed to use it. Certainly as good, and in many ways, better, than the computing experience that one may have using other operating systems - including Windows XP versions. |
| #29 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 4/12/2007 2:09:11 PM |
| #28: So, let me see if I understand what you are saying? You are saying that Latch (and I, for that matter) have no basis to argue that Microsoft should sell BOTH Windows XP and Vista, solely because we have not used Vista since the RC or Beta days? And you call him / us dogmatic? I've never owned a Honda Civic, Prelude, or Accord, but I can still see good business reasons for Honda to sell all three models, and I can see good economic reasons for Microsoft to sell both XP and Vista, if there is sufficient demand for both. I am not saying that XP should be sold forever, but if there is sufficient demand, I do not see what benefits there are to forcing people to only use the newest OS version, except politically motivated ones. That has nothing to do with whether or not Vista is better or worse than XP. I don't know which Honda model is better either, but that doesn't stop me from understanding the business benefits of selling different models and editions. |
| #30 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 4/12/2007 2:20:31 PM |
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#28: What utter crap. Your statement might be valid if I had been living in a cave for the past few years. I have been following the development of Vista since it was announced. I have read every review I have seen and have absorbed the experiences of many users, from hardcore geeks to simple business users. So far, nothing I've seen has been compelling enough to make me want to use it compared to XP, whereas the negative aspects are very hard to ignore. What you are getting from me is my opinion based on the many experiences of others. Its no different than saying "I heard it was a crap movie" because your friends saw it and said it was crap, and the local reviewer you trust said it was crap, the trailers you saw were unimpressive and you didn't like the interview one of the actors gave.
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| #31 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 4/12/2007 2:39:16 PM |
| It should also be mentioned that Dell is going Microsoft one better, and discontinuing XP sales sometime during or at the end of the current Summer season (Northern Hemisphere). So, they are not even waiting until the end of the Microsoft enforced time limit. |
| #32 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 4/12/2007 2:47:57 PM |
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#29, 30, Mystic, I am saying exactly what I said, for one to conclude that the reason that XP should not at some point be phased out of the OEM channel, because there is nothing compelling about its programmed replacement, and where such an opinion is not supported by direct experience, then such an opinion is largely irrelevant, empty and lacking a pragmatic base of support.
Your arguments are based upon different suppositions and are more valid - arguing that if a product remains in demand by customers then the seller should consider continuing to offer it. Obviously, a very different argument that would not necessarily require any experience of any kind with any of the associated products - reducing the decision to one influenced by basic business considerations - which by the way, I submit are being considered and as such, and appropriate, fair, and supportable decision is exactly what Microsoft has made. Latch's arguments include subjective and objective experience based properties that require that one must conclude that a personal opinion can't be well supported without personal experience. I do appreciate your defense of Latch and suspect it was offered just to keep the fires stoked - human interaction requires that, and most find such exchanges enjoyable. Do also note, that in my original post reference this subject, I did not identify Latch - Latch associated himself with the negative viewpoint that I offered was evident - while predictable, it does cause one to ask again, "what does Latch like?" My hope is that he does like something and that we can share what that is. Something simple, like a particular color, would do - anything to see something other than that which is negative - shoot, we could start a trend [okay, enough... now I'm the one stoking...] lk: Rock? rock: <nothing> lk: Rock? rock: <nothing> lk: Rock? rock: <nothing> lk: See, I told you, "nothing" |
| #33 By 76967 (68.194.154.33) at 4/12/2007 2:58:24 PM |
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Despite all the flaring tempers here. I would like to chime in. Personally, I think MS should lengthen the life expectancy of XP. But not for any of the reasons already discussed. As we all know vista is terribly resource intensive. So upgrading older machines often is not an option (or at least a very pricey one). For this reason consumers and small businesses are going to suffer. I have bought several vista machines for my company some low end some high end. And I can say without a doubt the cheaper ones (which came with vista loaded) people are unhappy with the performance of vista.
So while I understand MS's side of the phase out, I think they need to rethink it, to try to be more caring to their customers. Most regular people can't afford to throw out a few grand on a decent machine to give vista good speed and usability. When a equally modern lower end machine would run XP just fine. |
| #34 By 32132 (142.32.208.234) at 4/12/2007 3:06:36 PM |
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Bigots prefer to be as uninformed as possible. It threatens their worldview less.
It was hilarious to see such narrow minded twits insist I try another OS (consider I am a VMS Admin) when they haven't even tried Vista. |
| #35 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 4/12/2007 3:13:55 PM |
| This is nothing more than a Monopoly in action. You won't buy it, we'll FORCE you to. |
| #36 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 4/12/2007 3:28:26 PM |
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#32: The reason I am sticking up for Latch is that he has been echoing the same argument here that I have, namely that Microsoft should give people the option for both OSes, and reap the financial benefit of both revenue streams. He may have gone deeper into the reasons why they may have made the decision to do this, but his base argument in this thread has always been about giving the customer a choice.
As for keeping the fires stoked, when I want to do that, I egg on Parkkker. He is a much easier target, and he gets all riled up easier than Latch does. And it is more entertaining to see what is spewed out of his keyboard. #33: Well put! #35: Right on! When the Vista driver issues are worked out by all the major hardware makers, and Vista SP 1 is released to deal with many of the compatibility issues, I will likely purchase a new computer with Vista SP 1 pre-installed on it. Until then, my home machine will remain an XP box. That does not preclude me from using it at the office, however, if I ever get a system capable of running it in full Aero mode. I have no interest in a bare bones basic Vista install. |
| #37 By 32132 (142.32.208.234) at 4/12/2007 3:36:53 PM |
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#36 Latch says you are just an MS apologist.
And, if you had read my earlier post, you would know that anyone who buys an OEM copy of Vista Business or Ultimate has the legal right to install XP Professional instead. |
| #38 By 2201 (82.27.241.166) at 4/12/2007 3:43:11 PM |
| #35 inaccurate. Noone is forcing you to buy Vista. In fact, you will still be able to buy XP and install that on your machine seperately. If you don't want Vista, you don't have to buy it. |
| #39 By 37047 (216.191.227.68) at 4/12/2007 3:57:08 PM |
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#37: A) See popst #27
B) You mean they will let me use XP if I pay the higher price for Vista Ultimate? How generous of them. |
| #40 By 32132 (142.32.208.234) at 4/12/2007 5:03:34 PM |
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#39 XP OEM Profession is 139 on NewEgg. As is Vista Business OEM.
If you want more features, you can buy Vista Ultimate OEM for 189. You can downgrade either to Xp Pro. Isn't choice wonderful? |
| #41 By 20505 (216.102.144.11) at 4/12/2007 6:50:18 PM |
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I for one am an XP fanboy. Guess I'm SOL on this one. But one comment to those on this forum who work for (or have pull with) MS.
Could you guys please inform MS that a default XP look on the desk top for Vista would be wonderful. Why is it that I have to choose Aero or Classic Windows. I for one dislike both looks, in a word, one is fussy and stupid, and the other is from the stone age. Also what is it with Vista that it looks absolutely TERRIBLE with font smoothing turned off on an LCD screen? I absolutely hate this "feature" - XP is worlds better in this regard. Sorry to tell the bozos at MS but the "classic" interface for Windows is XP in all its simple utilitarian glory. |
| #42 By 2201 (194.205.219.2) at 4/13/2007 7:08:16 AM |
| #41 Funny that cos I've also heard lots of people who utterly hate the XP "Fisher Price" look. Me, personally I don't care, I simply use WindowBlinds and change it to whatever I like. |
| #43 By 2332 (66.92.78.241) at 4/13/2007 10:44:16 AM |
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Glad to see that the FUDing of Vista has spread into the Activewin forums.
I'm in the process of writing what will probably become a 10-part series on the FUDing of Windows Vista. See Part 1: http://www.robertdowney.com/2007/01/fuding-of-windows-vista.html See Part 2: http://www.robertdowney.com/2007/01/fuding-of-windows-vista-part-2.html See Part 3: http://www.robertdowney.com/2007/02/fuding-of-windows-vista-part-3.html It is pretty clear to me that most people don't realize how good an OS Vista is, mostly because they rely on the "reviews" out there, from people like Mossberg, that are so inept it's pathetic. |
| #44 By 61 (12.108.60.37) at 4/13/2007 11:13:59 AM |
| Tech, how exactly is discontinuing to sell a product (and note, this is only OEMs we are talking about here) that is 6 years old (ancient in the computer industry) a monopoly in action, and forcing? |
| #45 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 4/13/2007 11:16:12 AM |
| #43 - Man, that is great work! I intend to refer many people to your site to review what you have put together. I think it will help people make much more informed decisions about Windows Vista. |
| #46 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 4/13/2007 1:54:56 PM |
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#44,
It's all about INTENT. It is MS's INTENT to force people to Vista. I don't see how that can be denied. TL |
| #47 By 61 (12.108.60.37) at 4/13/2007 2:03:57 PM |
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YOU say it is their intent to "force" Vista on you.
But let's look at the facts. Microsoft is still providing updates for XP (and will continue to do so until it's standard end of life). You can still buy XP in stores. Your XP install will not deactivate. You will still be able to activate XP. The switch over to Vista for OEMs does not effect pricing in any way. I could go on. Now, unless Bill Gates is beating down your door with an m16 in hand, or Steve B. is comeing to annoy you with his squirrelly voice and horrible dancing, I would say they are not forcing you to do anything. Now, of course they want to migrate everyone over to their new product. Are you going to kick and scream about EVERY single company that ever was, is, or will ever be, for wanting to miagrate customers to their new product. This post was edited by CPUGuy on Friday, April 13, 2007 at 14:05. |
| #48 By 2201 (86.27.92.205) at 4/13/2007 2:32:14 PM |
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#46 You must be weak-willed then. They are people who are still on Windows 98. And that's good, cos no one's forcing anyone to upgrade.
So what if Windows XP will cease to be at the OEM level, that's what's happened with every other Windows release since Godknowswhen and it doesn't stop you from buying it seperately at all. As #43 has pointed out, pure FUD. BTW '43, no link to part 3 on the bottom of part 2. But good article, bookmarked! This post was edited by testman on Friday, April 13, 2007 at 14:36. |
| #49 By 2332 (66.92.78.241) at 4/13/2007 3:38:50 PM |
| Fixed the missing link in part 2. Thanks for the heads up. |
| #50 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 4/14/2007 5:59:35 PM |
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#48,
No need to get personal. And I assure you I am anything but weak-willed. Just ask the guys around here :) TL |
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