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Microsoft May Double Its Investment in Xbox | |
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| Time: 09:50 EST/14:50 GMT | News Source: Reuters | Posted By: Robert Stein | ||
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Software giant Microsoft Corp. MSFT.O said on Wednesday it would pour more resources into its efforts to carve out a position in the $10 billion video game market rather than cutting its losses and exiting from the venture. Microsoft's Chief Financial Officer John Connors, when asked if the world's number one software maker had an "exit strategy" for the year-old Xbox video game machine, said in a Web cast: "The fallback position is probably to double down and make it successful." | ||
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| #26 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 6:28:23 PM |
| macross, the lead is not limited to being out a year an advance. Sony just sold 10 million units in the same time it took MS to sell under a million. MS is going to get a year lead on Sony, huh? How? It's about to be 2003--MS wouldn't be able to keep the chips from Intel and Nvidia completely quiet if it's just a year away. |
| #27 By 665 (64.126.91.172) at 12/5/2002 6:42:01 PM |
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I am defending the Xbox, but I'm not going to rattle on with some fanboy drivel. MS won't get their console out anytime before PS3, and they shouldn't. Take a look at all of the consoles, and their makers, who were really big one generation, and within two were basically gone. Nintendo, Sega, PS2. They all had their prime, and I think the pattern will hold true with the Xbox.
It seams the games that are the stupidest are the ones that become the hits. Look at Grand Theft Auto. It's a fine game, but all you do is ride around and steal cars. It's a good game, but if someone were pitching that idea to you, would you really think that would be the flagpole release for the 'premier' system for the most critical time of the year? I'm sure the Xbox will get their games, in time (though I agree about Blinx, I absolutely hate that game). I've heard of people who were getting Xboxes just to get to play Splinter Cell a few months before it came out on the PC. Gamers are like that, that is one thing I don't think you understand. Sometimes I don't think MS understands it either, but I think for a large part, they have. At first, they came on too strong, like "OOO, look how bad I am!!! I'm black!!! PS2 blows!!!" but they seem to have kind of gotten into the grove of things lately. I also think Xbox Live will be something that helps the Xbox a lot. I'm not sure on its overall effect on console sales, but I think it will help. The truth is, Xbox has done better now that a lot of people initially thought it would. I think they will be able to hold onto that, and if they do, then they will be successful. |
| #28 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 6:54:14 PM |
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Macross, I thought you meant they would take the same advantage when you said they would take it away.
"so using common sense" won't developers stick with the console that has 50 million users today rather than the one which hasn't hit 5 million? Won't developers want to reuse their code and further extend it--rather than saying, "Well, these two consoles came out at about the same time, so no one has an advantage--let's scrap our 50 million users and two years of code we developed and pick the other guy now instead because ...." Well, because why? near 1 to 1 ratio? Ha, ha, ha. You say the XBox is the premiere console, better than the PS2, and you expect the next ones to be equal, but they'll now sell at a 1 to 1 ratio even though the inferior device is outselling Xbox 10 to 1 right now? Hilarious. Distributed computing is less viable than distributed competitors? How the hell so? If you can harness cpu power from distributed devices in the background--aren't you happy with whatever you get? Whereas if you are playing a distributed game, aren't you pissed if you are moving slower than your competitor? I would say XBox Live is much more dependent on broadband than Cell. (What's very good broadband by the way? Ha, ha.) |
| #29 By 3653 (63.162.177.140) at 12/5/2002 7:12:02 PM |
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So many sodajerk inaccuracies! Let me just cherry pick a couple of quotes...
"There's a chance MS will move to jump ahead with an XBox2 earlier" Please show me where you are reading this. I have NEVER heard ANYONE make such a ridiculous guess. "macross, the lead is not limited to being out a year an advance. Sony just sold 10 million units in the same time it took MS to sell under a million." Of course its related to them having the year head start. Are you insane? Read the press, for God's sake. Its WELL-KNOWN, that Microsoft debuted their console and had the FASTEST 1 million consoles sold in the history of the console industry. Hell, Microsoft even issued a press release about it. But of course, you'll take the easy road and respond with "Oh, yeah and MS never lied in a press release". It was widely reported. Oh, and no I'm not looking it up for you. Do your own damn research. |
| #30 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 7:19:44 PM |
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What does a fast uptake represent to you? There are lots of sh!tty movies with great first weeks that stall flat. There are a lot of zealous console geeks and softies--but can they attract beyond that crowd? At some point a 10 million unit lead shouldn't be a factor and they should be growing at the same pace. Well, in the most recently reported period that was far from the case. THe PS2 is still selling substantially greater numbers than the XBox. Being 10,000,000 units ahead doesn't mean that the XBox shouldn't be able to sell better than 1/5 to 1/10 the number of Playstations. But that's what's happening today... after they have both been established in the market for over a year.
Since they are selling at a dramatically slower pace TODAY than the PS2, but the first month of the XBox was substantially better than Sony's first month, isn't that a sign that the interest in the XBox is waning, or that the PS2 is substantially more attractive? Doesn't that exactly mirror the crappy movie analogy? This post was edited by sodajerk on Thursday, December 05, 2002 at 19:22. |
| #31 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 7:24:36 PM |
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By the way, the XBox2 earlier bit: there was a recent interview with Allchin or Ballmer I forget which that talked about the 2005 date of the PS3, and the reply was along the lines of: "that won't matter." With a smile and a wink, kind of thing--I took that to mean they may try to preempt them. But, macross, do you know the meaning of "may" and "chance"? And I was just putting it out there to look at as many possiblities as possible. This post was edited by sodajerk on Thursday, December 05, 2002 at 19:25. |
| #32 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 7:42:37 PM |
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Silly, silly deflections, macross. Just look at the recent data on the Reg: when MS agressively repriced the units and threw in the freebies, they released numbers for the UK that looked like they had gotten to with 80% to 90% of current PS2 sales; Now, the Reg has numbers for the last week of November that shows Sony sold 90,000 and the XBox sold 21,000--so Sony is back to a 4.5x greater number of sales even though the same incentives are still in place for the Box... Why? Because they had sold 10 mill first? You cannot account for these differences by the first eight months. As Todd said price and power are not great enough factors--even with the new pricing in place, this "bump" couldn't be sustained by MS because people would still prefer the PS2.
In the next generation, you are 100% confident about writing off installed base and backward-compatibility? That's ridiculous. With the next generation, you do not go back to zero. Why would Cell DEPEND on the networked capacity? Do you expect the chip to be under-powered for solo use? Ridiculous. You will get an advanced level of play from a single PS3 than you would a single PS2. If you have it on a network, it will perform even better. Again, ridiculous. A lot of pipe dreaming going into the Cell? There already taping off prototypes; they announced one of the largest chip manufacturing partnerships; and IBM built a 5 billion dollar facility to produce it and the new POWER derivatives... Are you kidding? So how is this relying on broadband? And isn't broadband usage likely to be better in 2 years than it is now? So which is riskier: game play dependent upon broadband NOW, or ENHANCED play thorugh broadband two years from now? I wasn't suggesting that you were saying XBox Live wasn't dependent on broadband--I was saying that Live is riskier than Cell. This post was edited by sodajerk on Thursday, December 05, 2002 at 20:15. |
| #33 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 7:56:00 PM |
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I guess you are saying that 10 to 1 sale ratio will always be if the product has a launch lead... So I guess you are saying that if MS gets to 15 million by 2005, then Sony will be at (15-5=10 x 5 (just to be ultra-conservative)= 50) 100 million users by the time the next generation comes out.
And you don't think there will be any? zip? zero? zilch? carry-over of the user base when it's 15 million to 100 million users? Huh. |
| #34 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 8:23:47 PM |
| If you can't tell, I love hammering this one in, Macross? According to you, there is no way that MS can EVER meet or exceed the sale rate of the PS2 because it came out ahead of time and for that reason alone? Really. That's amazing and depressing. |
| #35 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 8:42:09 PM |
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Let's see, a new generation comes out--2 or 3 options to choose from, one which is compatible with the 5 to 50 games you have, you'll pick the one that's incompatible. What the hell are you talking about backwards-comaptibility is irrelevant?! We are projecting what the future picture might look like, we aren't saying revert back to PS2 because you've already bought games!! I wonder if you actually believed that drivel or if you just thought maybe you could slip it by me.
Uhh, the Reg DATA comes from gameindustry.biz I'm not suggesting beating them either, macross; I've told you that you are the number one fanboy of the the losing console with pipedreams haven't I? I'm asking if you are suggesting that the 10,000,000 lead means that PS2 will always outpace the XBox, no matter what the lead was initially. Don't get why you don't get that? At some point, XBox will need to have higher growth rates than Sony's offering. I know the reasons why the PS2 is ahead: better games, better play, more games, better exclusive titles, reliable track record, etc, etc, etc... It has nothing to do with having a lead. What data do you dispute? This post was edited by sodajerk on Thursday, December 05, 2002 at 20:45. |
| #36 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 9:06:10 PM |
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TO recap: your theory is that the only explanation for the PS2s success is being released earlier. You also theorize that customers have no desire to continue with a preferred platform with each new generation.
This zero to number two baloney is such bullsh!t: They've also spent several billions of dollars in the process. I see nothing particularly successful about that. At some point, they do need to make a profit. I don't know when if ever that will be. "well you might say Sony could tell people who don't have a PS2 that they can play all previous games from PS1 to PS3 on the new system. well with those runaway numbers on the PS2 don't you think chances are they already have one?? so they can't really use that as a selling point now can they." I have no idea what the hell you are saying here. I know that despite initial releases usually having big bursts, the PS2 sold 10 mill the first 10 months, and sold a subsequent 35+ million this year.... That means more and more people are choosing it NOW over the alternatives. Also, I specifically know many PS2 owners who bought the device this year because it was backward compatible. Why you discount that is bizarre. Most people do not want 3 consoles set up in their living room, or want to pass on their older device to a relative or friend or sell it. This is most certainly a selling point. Did you have anything to say about abandoning the code previously developed for the PS2 and starting over for the XBox2? No, I didn't think you had any reasons to suggest that there would be a true 1 to 1 adoption rate for the next gen. |
| #37 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 9:07:41 PM |
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Why do I need to give links when most everyone else has agreed that the PS2 has better games?
GIVE YOU LINKS (TO WHAT)? |
| #38 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 9:19:59 PM |
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"maybe you should try to understand english better Jerk it was a simply enough statement."
Yes, it was simply enough statement. Wait a second, huh? What point have you made: most of them are ludicrous--Sony had a slow uptake the first ten months, it has skyrocketed now. MS made pricing efforts and freebie efforts to be competitive, they only worked temporaily and there pace is equal to Nintendo's again. The sales pace goes up and down, but MS hasn't gotten close to surpassing Sony even with a nifty little base of games now. How do you attract software--by having the largest base of users. Todd agreed that MS has to step up and deliver big time--I presume that's because he beleives Sony has better games. This is common knowledge stuff anyway so I don't need to demonstrate it. Sure, code will need to be reworked--more or less so for the XBox than the PS2? More. Hence more cost. Smaller user base, less profit. I don't recall Sony, Square, or Rockstar being unproftiable after the first year and telling stockholders that their only strategy was to throw twice as much money at it, No. |
| #39 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 12/5/2002 9:25:47 PM |
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"LOL you are lying out your damn pants now...the most reason data showed the PS2 with an installed user base of 14.1 million as of July 2002."
Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!! Are you kidding?!! They've sold 40+ million units weeks ago, fool. Yes, that's amazing growth isn't it? You're a nutter, macross. Sony also recently reaffirmed that they will surpass 50 million by year end. Yes, this is absolutely fact and easily confirmed, fool. This is my point; you want me to "provide links" for what everyone else excepts as fact. Check it out for yourself, dumb@ss, everyone else knows it to be true. Again, this demonstrates my point that the lead has nothing to do with the reason why they are kicking the tar out of MS today. |
| #40 By 135 (208.50.206.187) at 12/5/2002 9:31:20 PM |
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I'm curious why any of this matters?
I have an XBox. I have considered buying a PS2 as well just so I can get GTA. |
| #41 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 9:55:55 PM |
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God damn, you are one lazy mother. As I said, this has been well established fact for weeks, fool:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/2373399.stm Even your numbers for the other units are way behind. Haven't you noticed the numbers that I've been using throughout this discussion and for the last month? For Christ sakes, no wonder I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. |
| #42 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 10:31:57 PM |
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"Sony has only sold 3.1 million in Japan this year that's a fact."
Jesus Christ, you are freakin hilarious, macross. At least, you've got me laughing. Can someone else please take the time to teach macross how to search the web and find reported data and/or news sources that can at least be trusted to provide the very little data that is accurate. BobSmith maybe, please help, Bob! Soda? I can't take it. I don't trust any of the blather from In-Stat, macross. And I agree that Sony has numerous strengths; I simply dispute your assertion that poor growth can be dismissed by a market introduction lead for the entire life of the generation, and that in the next generation, the scoreboard goes back to zero and it's a free-for-all marketplace. That's laughable. Soda, good question. I think it's an interesting thing to watch evolve. I'm psyched to see what comes out of all this. It's not like I think Microsoft is doomed nor that they shouldn't be on the market--I just want to see them get their butts handed to them, and for the accounting and the burning of huge sums of capital in order to penetrate and acquire markets get them out of favor on wall street. Maybe they'll have something good, and bully, but right now, I see them heavily discounting and promoting XBox and the market doesn't seem to have the hunger for it. Maybe the home media/game console will work, but I think it won't. Not because it's Microsoft, but because every home will want a home media unit, but not every family will want a game console. Maybe silly logic--I definitely agree it's simple logic. That's just my bet and belief. This post was edited by sodajerk on Thursday, December 05, 2002 at 22:46. |
| #43 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 10:55:33 PM |
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ssfreitas, I actually haven't read that much of what IBM, Sony, is it Toshiba (Toshiba, right? anyway...) have said, but what I have read, it does seem a pretty bold claim, doesn't it? But I think it's there and that IBM is doing some amazing stuff these days in a lot of chip sectors . (Hint, hint: I think there will be other Power-based devices in people's houses. AND Also... I'm not imagining traditional broadband (DSL, cable) internet connections anyway--I'm thinking ethernet, FW2, Wi-Fi, etc... Yes, there are big bottlenecks all along the way, which is why I lean to FW, and whatever the fastest, securist Wi-Fi there is at the time.)
And besides: according to macross's sources high number of gamers have broadband: "The study also showed 50 percent of Xbox users have a broadband Internet connection, compared with 41 percent of PS2 owners and 31 percent of GameCube owners." (If you trust his sources. Hhhmmmppphhh.) This post was edited by sodajerk on Thursday, December 05, 2002 at 22:57. |
| #44 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 11:06:21 PM |
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"nothing new to add i see lol" Hit refresh before posting such nonsense, fool. Sorry man, you've just got me tired of talking to you now that I realize you are so behind on accurate data. Oh, and you sad, little thing--you actually believe that XBox is at 2.8 million, don't you? Even I wouldn't make that exaggerated misunderestimation! Oh well.
Did I start to talk about the reasons why PS3 will succeed? All I have been saying is that the XBox IS getting trounced NOW, and Sony has huge amounts of momentum going into the NEXT generation that cannot be overlooked or dismissed. |
| #45 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 11:10:24 PM |
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Top Two Most Desired Features of Action:
1. An auto-refresh! A simple one! A timed one if it has to be! 2. Links on the main page to the 2nd or 3rd or 4th or however many pages there may be, instead of clicking to the first and THEN clicking Next or Last! Come on, .Net Super Whizzes, Stand Up! Sharpen Your Mines! And Help the Staff of ActiveWin Creak Forward! On Features! On! We Can Do It If We Try! Super Whizzes Away! (sorry, macross, has got me going crazy) |
| #46 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 11:16:20 PM |
| This comment has been removed due to a violation of the Active Network Terms of Use. |
| #47 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 11:18:27 PM |
| Please don't edit that, admin guys. I consider the above post my freakin' masterpiece of the evening. |
| #48 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 11:28:18 PM |
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why I don't believe your data? "The publisher of gaming magazines said the PS2 has a user base of 14.1 million units now, expected to rise to 24.1 million by 2003."
Your data sources is "the publisher of gaming magazines"? Jesus. And his data is already, just a guess, I haven't seen numbers for about 6 weeks, 20 million units off? |
| #49 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 11:37:04 PM |
| I'm telling you that I am so bored with your dumb ass, that I don't need to trace your dumb ass numbers when I am aware of the accurate numbers. I remain unimpressed. |
| #50 By 3339 (67.116.255.1) at 12/5/2002 11:58:51 PM |
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If my numbers are accurate and known facts, I'm not documenting sh!t, dumbass. Denial nothing. Denial, my @ss! Have you admitted that all day when I was using accurate numbers (but who the hell knows wehre I got ACCURATE numbers from) you had no idea that I was saying Sony was at 50 million, and that I was presuming you understand that I was projecting through this month. That you are a dumb @ss who has no idea what an accurate number is and for that matter what I am saying? Have you admitted that?
PlanetXBox numbers? Who cares? Why did you neglect to mention the 276,000 thousand that MS barely sold??!! That's one shipment, and a baby turd, an't it? But you didn't mention it? Why not? Seriously, the second shipment after the 250,000--how many do you think they sent over? 50,000? Jeez, maybe the Japanese hate Microsoft more than I do. Why didn't you mention that Japans population is 120,000,000 and provide a link? Whatever, macross. |
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