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Paramount adopts HD DVD, kicks Blu-ray to the curb | |
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| Time: 12:35 EST/17:35 GMT | News Source: Ars Technica | Posted By: Jonathan Tigner | ||
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Just when many observers are beginning to believe that Blu-ray has the next-gen HD format wars all wrapped up, Paramount throws us a major curveball. The studio has announced that it is abandoning Blu-ray in favor of HD DVD. Is a shake-up in the works? Both Paramount and DreamWorks Animation SKG today announced their backing of HD DVD, which will entail exclusive use of the HD DVD format. The decision will see movies from Paramount Pictures, DreamWorks Pictures, Paramount Vantage, Nickelodeon Movies and MTV Films available in standard definition DVD and HD DVD, exclusively. | ||
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| #1 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 8/20/2007 3:03:35 PM |
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Eggggcellent :)
Transformers on HD DVD :) TL |
| #2 By 3746 (72.12.161.38) at 8/20/2007 3:42:21 PM |
| speaking of HD-DVD - I currenty have the addon for the Xbox and it is hooked up direct to my TV. I watched 300 the other day and found that during the talking/quiet scenes it was so quiet that I had to turn it up. As soon as there was any loud action it was super loud. Does anyone else have this problem? Maybe it was just 300. I was going to try another disc and see - it was rather annoying to constantly be turning the TV up and down when watching a movie. |
| #3 By 26496 (67.163.251.151) at 8/20/2007 4:55:42 PM |
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Don't worry it's not your TV or the HD DVD or even the Xbox for that matter. I rented the movie not in HD format when it first appeared on Comcast on Demand a few weeks back. I had the same issue, I could barely hear anything then when the stuff hit the fan I then had to turn down. I've noticed this on many movies both HD and Standard and on DVD or On Demand... I do NOT own the HD DVD yet for my 360 which I will sooner or later but when getting On Demand since that is how I get all my movies in both HD and Standard it doesn't matter. Another example was Underworld in HD same affect for me...
So it could just be how they are recorded or it could be the TV not using external speakers... I can and have used my Surround Sound system and it even still does the same thing, so I'd point more toward the stamping/recording of the film etc... |
| #4 By 11888 (67.71.153.235) at 8/20/2007 6:10:36 PM |
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I picked up the Xbox HD-DVD box at Best Buy. The price was still $199 in Canada but what really turned me off was it still included King Kong! It took me 4 or 5 sittings to get through that movie.
I still don't have one but I'll probably give in soon enough. |
| #5 By 15497 (67.158.171.176) at 8/20/2007 6:20:16 PM |
| The greater dynamic range (volue extremes) you are referring to are normal for Dolby Digital and higher-end digital audio formats. Most A/V receivers can flatten that range for Home Theatre audio systems... |
| #6 By 1896 (68.153.171.248) at 8/20/2007 6:26:21 PM |
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So guys let me ask you a question:
As far as picture quality do you really see a huge difference between a DVD played in an "Upscaling player" and a HD DVD or Blu Ray ones? Obviously there is a difference but, IMO, not so much; I mean it is not like a VHS and a DVD. I have a lways been an early adopter for thechnology items, I still have a Laser Disc player (-:, but so far I do not have any interest in either one of the new formats. I am not sure if it was because, as I mentioned before, the difference is not so impressive, the way DRM is pushed on consumer s(DVD-Audio and SACD failure docet), or a combination of these and other factors. Of course "Holographic Versatile Disc" is a different story... |
| #7 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/20/2007 7:55:32 PM |
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#6, Yes - there is a huge difference and don't let people tell you otherwise.
There are also differences in up-converting players, and the HD DVD players by Toshiba up-convert better than any non-HD DVD player that up-converts SD DVD. The point is, the HD DVD 30 [as in 30 GB discs] using VC-1 are nothing short of stunning. They also up-convert SD DVD extremly well, but not quite to the level of a native HD DVD. So far, BD is a mixed bag of lower res titles - none of which look as good as HD DVD - even the BD 50 [as in 50 GB] titles. The transfers are not as good. Many are BD 25 using MPEG 2 and those that are BD 50 are also MPEG 2 in many case. This means that any storage volume advantage in BD is wasted due to a less efficient codec. All but a tiny number of HD DVD's use VC-1 [mandatory as available on both HD DVD and BD players by the DVD Forum, which endorses HD DVD]. **And we do have both HD DVD and BD [Toshiba STB and Sony BD STB] - so we have compared on the same displays and in some cases, the same titles in both formats. HD DVD is far and away the early and clear(er) leader as far as quality is concerned. Before I go further there are a couple of variables that matter a great deal. 1) Your eyes and your vision. HD DVD and or BD only look as good as one can see - so viewing distance matters. If you have a smaller 32 - 42" HDTV and you are 10 to 14 feet away from the display, you will not notice native HD as much as you will with a killer 50 to 70" inch display. 2) Your display matters a lot - LCD and Plasma look better than DLP, or rear projection [especially after a year or two when the DLP blub really should be replaced]. Obviously, smaller displays at 32 to 42 from 7 feet look amazing [and this is how one views them in stores, BTW...] So have good eyesight, or have it corrected and use a display that you are not too far from - 42" won't cut it at 12+ feet and you won't see much benefit in HD DVD over up-converted SD DVD. If you do have a larger screen or shorter viewing range, go for HD DVD - you won't regret it and frankly, you won't like SD much at all and you'll avoid it. If you have a media room at 14 to 18 feet, go for front projection and a reactive screen of 110" - you will not regret it and it is not nearly as costly as a larger rear projection DLP. If you do have DLP, plan on replacing the bulb every year [I'm not kidding - even modest use will require this]. *** #4, The Transfer in King Kong is kind of sloppy [to me]. 300, Sahara, and Serenity were better by far. HD DVD provided us so much detail that we could see the layers in CGI renders and it made scenes look less real. Finally, #6, nothing is token locked and "AnyDVD HD" easily allows one to RIP and backup an HD DVD. There is no reason to fear the protected path - you can legally use your content regardless of display and even player [HDCP compliance or not]. I RIP and mount mine to a UMPC and they work just fine in full HD DVD glory. HDCP is no biggie, either - about everything shipping supports it - so it is transparent. |
| #8 By 1896 (68.153.171.248) at 8/20/2007 8:54:26 PM |
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Thanks for comments Iketchum; very clear and in-depth as usual.
Just two observations: It is true that corporations have not enforced the token...yet; doing it would have be an early death sentence for the new formats and while their management is not the brightest they are not so dumb too. What about the future? I cannot read the future, and if I could I would be busy playing lotteries around the world, but I am not so hopeful about Hollywood fairness. I am quite sure you remember all the crying big Majors made when the first VCRs became available; of course sales of VCR cassettes yesterday and DVDs today have become the bulk of their revenues. Also I am puzzled by the part about ripping: my understanding is that I, a double citizenship individual, who buy DVDs in Europe where the legislations ruling this matter are different, can make a personal backup copy of my media, but both US Citizens and foreigners who buys DVDs sold in the US are not allowed to do so under the provisions of the "Digital Millenium Act". Now if I read correctly the meaning of your statement this is incorrect. Are you sure of this? |
| #9 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/20/2007 10:45:49 PM |
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#8, Under the "Fair use" provisions of the DMA, one may lawfully take those actions necessary to safeguard the media one has purchased - this is clear language meant to provide the basis for both backup and use on any device one may also personally own.
The language in the DMA is a lot clearer than many in the press on our side of the pond want to admit - and that forms the basis for many of the arguments I present in this regard. Similarly, Windows Vista does not provide any added "Tilt Bit Code" to any part of any path - protected or otherwise. Vista does however provide a protected path "IF" content providers and hardware manufacturers wish to use it [e.g., they are not forced to]. Vista supports this path in the same way STB and display manufacturers do. By the way, downloadable content is the only content so protected, so far. None of this prevents one from making fair use of such media - for backups, or ripping via authorized means. There are even dedicated media servers that specifically provide for this - our new home has them for whole-house distribution. I would buy and enjoy HD media if I were you. The experience is a lot better than SD - both for video and audio. Life is too short to not experience such things when they are so easily accessed. I spend more time being thankful for the blessings we have and the many choices that come along with them - so many people don't have such trivial things to worry about. Bottom line: "Don't buy into the BS hype a lot of Generation - Y kids parrot - the DMA and DRM are not that big a deal for people who "BUY" their media - there are ways to make fair use of it. Those making a big and false stink about all of it want what they have always wanted - a means to steal "perfect" digital content. Such theft by the same group of people is what got us in this DRM/DMA mess to begin with. Guys like you and me and so many here that "BUY" or media, are not the problem - thieves are and we ought not forget that." |
| #10 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 8/21/2007 7:50:40 AM |
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#1,
It's called Dynamic Range, something 300 has in spades. Here's a tip for movies like this. Check and see if your receiver has a "Nighttime" audio setting. My Yamaha RX-V2400 does and many others do as well. What this does is scrunch up the dynamic range so there isn't so much of a difference between the quietest and loudest passages. This allows you to set the volume by the loudest patches, and not lose out on the quiet passages. Thus their naming it the "Nighttime" mode. On car stereo's it's typically called "Comp" or "Compression". Does the same thing so you don't lose quiet passages in car/road noise. TL |
| #11 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 8/21/2007 8:07:01 AM |
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#6,
I'm with you on every point except that of DLP. I spent two months shopping for my HD TV, and in the end the DLP provided a comparable picture quality and a MUCH lower price point for a 50" HD TV. I have the Samsung HL-P5085W. Affectionately known as the "Capt' Kirk" model. The picture shows why: "http://g-ec2.images-amazon.com/images/I/41KBK50YC0L._SS500_.jpg" Of course this model has the (at the time) higher-end HD2+ chipset. I'll put the picture quality up against most any other set. And the lamp? My TV is on a solid 8 hours a day. The TV is over 3 years old and the lamp is still going strong and shows no signs of weakness or coloration changes. That is probably because I run a UPS on this TV. Using a UPS on a rear-projection type TV is an absolute must for long life. I can explain why if anyone wants to know. My only gripe with this TV now is it only has one HDMI and one DVI input (as well as PC, 2 Video, 2 SVideo and 2 HD Component). While one of each was fine 3 years ago, I'm now finding out that I really need 3 HDMI inputs. Xbox, DVR and DVD. I've got the XBox on HDMI, the DVR on DVI, but I need one more for my other DVD player. I'll have to run that over component, and upscalliing DVD players do not upscale over Component (at the wishes of the media moguls). There was an exception to this, but it's long gone these days (the Zenith). I thought of getting a new receiver with multiple HDMI inputs, but I've read that these don't really work correctly with HDCP, which makes them useless. TL |
| #12 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 8/21/2007 8:07:51 AM |
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You know, it's a good thing I've gotten into the habit of doing select-all and copy on long posts, because I would have lost that entire thing to the login bug if I hadn't.
TL |
| #13 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/21/2007 9:48:12 AM |
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#11, We always use UPS units - no matter what we plug in down here [the south, spring... storms. all in the S.E. know what I mean].
I'm very glad you got one of the models that shipped with the newer and better Tungsten Filament Lamp - we've replaced a great many and even the newer ones that replaced the discontinued ones begin to BUZZ very loudly after a short while [driving owners nuts]. The set you have and the model identical to it sans the base, were rare gems [you must have picked it up winter 2005]. Later, commercial 1080P models in the 67.5 size were also good, but fell victim to Tungsten Filament Lamp failures [at 285 per lamp, protecting customers isn't cheap]. BTW, the VGA input on that model supports 1920 x 1080 resolutions, and while not a progressively scanning unit, the input is still way up there for PC/console gaming. I agree that DLP is comparible, just not all the time and for as long. It is subtle but replace the lamp and you'll see exactly what I mean. It will appear many times clearer and brighter for a while - a year later, you'll want to do it again. Not saying other don't fade... they do - just not as quickly. All of it is HD TV's dirty little secret - it not being grandpa's CRT, they do not hold their value nearly as well. But hey, at least with DLP you CAN replace the lamp - something to consider. |
| #14 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 8/21/2007 11:46:37 AM |
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I keep it under warranty, and my warranty covers the lamp.
I'll not have to pay for it when it does go boom :) TL |
| #15 By 2960 (24.254.95.224) at 8/21/2007 11:47:57 AM |
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Oh, and I still use the lower brightness settings :) I got room to crank if I need to!
TL |
| #16 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/21/2007 11:57:39 AM |
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#14, 15, Thanks, TL - If I may ask, subjectively, what percentage of HD vice SD content do you display as a percentage and at what res. 720P, 1080i, etc... it does matter, as does the brigtness and contrast one uses [in the context of lamp life and optimal performance].
Similarly, signal source is a factor - cable based HD is of a lower quality than satellite - 720 over 1080 for most sat HD channels with Dish Network [as you may recall, Direct TV got busted down-sampling HD in order to provide for more channels - as DISH went up with MPEG 4 over MPEG 2 this Aug 15th]. Each of these contribute to the experience. Thanks. |
| #17 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 8/21/2007 2:52:30 PM |
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#9: It's amazing to sit here and watch you defend DRM, framing anyone who doesn't embrace it as an immature thief. Regardless of your pronouncements (no matter how many quotes they're enclosed in), nobody likes DRM and it does nothing but penalize those who play by the rules. DRM has not yet stopped the professionals pressing DVDs. It hasn't stopped the warez scene. It seems to me that the only people DRM is stopping are those wanting to make a backup of their purchased media but not savvy enough to navigate the DRM waters. Now Wal-Mart is selling DRM-free mp3s from both EMI and Universal. Thank goodness for the DRM-laden media players to finally wake the people up:
Guy 1: "Cool, I just got this new media player with PlaysForSure!" Guy 2: "Does it play this song file?" Guy 1: "Um, no." |
| #18 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/21/2007 4:02:07 PM |
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#17, Yeah, right... and warez didn't and doesn't exist, and neither did the old napster, Limewire and a bevy of other illicit activities... none of that theft ever took place and it didn't hammer pressed media sales, either.
None of that highly illegal activity came before DRM. Right... You are quite right about people not liking DRM - no one does, but that does not change how or why it came about or how one manages it and if and when DRM evolves, we'll then have to discuss water-marking DRM Free media as vended by WalMart and others - either way, we will see digital controls placed on media and for the same reasons DRM was evolved in the first place - BECAUSE PEOPLE STOLE DIGITAL CONTENT. I don't like locks either and I don't like alarms and the myriad of security layers I have to fund at our centers, but all of it exists not to stop, but retard the IC of theft and or mitigate the damage it causes - again, all because people steal. Now, it is indeed very sad that younger people do not seem to understand this and they do not seem to understand how the theft of digital media and software is in fact, THEFT and a CRIME. Don't obfuscate that, Latch - no one buys it. |
| #19 By 28801 (65.90.202.10) at 8/21/2007 7:49:53 PM |
| Lloyd, I understand what you are saying - illegal is illegal, wrong is wrong, but you’re nuts If you think I’m going to shed a tear for the record companies or movie studios. I’ve spent thousands of dollars over the years buying albums and CDs for one good song on each piece of plastic (at least, back in the day you could get a 45). I for one am thankful for how illegal downloads have forced the industry to adapt, not with DRM but with affordable songs. I think the industry will continue to adapt and ultimately drop this DRM nonsense. |
| #20 By 15406 (74.104.251.89) at 8/21/2007 8:25:14 PM |
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#18: Yeah, right... and warez didn't and doesn't exist, and neither did the old napster, Limewire and a bevy of other illicit activities... none of that theft ever took place and it didn't hammer pressed media sales, either.
Honestly, I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Yes, these things all happened before DRM and they're still happening now despite all the various DRM schemes that have been foisted upon us. That what I'm trying to say. "DRM Does Not Work, Never Has And Never Will." The music companies are just now coming around to that fact. I'm sure that money has been lost by various industries due to illegal copying, but I do not for a second take their own self-serving "studies" any more seriously than the various MS-funded studies. I notice that you didn't comment on how DRM is totally ineffective in stopping anyone other than your grandmother from copying. I'll tell you one thing. I don't buy & play many games, but when I do, my very next stop is gamecopyworld so I can get a no-CD crack. DRM does not stop copying. DRM stops you from using media you have purchased in ways the content creator does not want you to. Lastly, I need to point out that refusal to accept DRM does not equate with support of copyright infringement, just in case you were already reaching for that strawman. This post was edited by Latch on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 at 20:25. |
| #21 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/22/2007 8:37:08 AM |
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#20, So you're seriously going to feign that you don't know what I am saying...
Ok. Simply, DRM is the result of widespread and rampant theft of digital content. Like locks before it, DRM is there to slow thieves down. Like locks, DRM is a pain, expensive and people don't like it, but they use them as thieves are a bigger problem and even more expensive. DRM is not perfect - no more than an security is, but it does help. I don't like that we have to have police, criminal courts, jails and the lot of it, either.... it all costs a lot, but it all is the result of crime. If people had not stolen. for what you are saying to be true, where CDROM and DVD sales are either down, or flat, there would have to be fewer people consuming digital media and online sales would have to account for the loss of pressed media sales - but that is not the case. Consumer count and consumption are both up - but sales are down. So where are the dollars? |
| #22 By 15406 (216.191.227.68) at 8/22/2007 9:51:55 AM |
| #21: Well, once again we're going to agree to disagree. You're on record as being a defender of Microsoft, Bush & the Republicans and now DRM. You must be a real hit at parties. |
| #23 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/22/2007 10:48:23 AM |
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#22, Weak, Latch, weak... Clearly, I am a defender of the individual right to own and dispose of property. A right central to the individual pursuit of happiness and the greatest level of individual liberty and one's exercise over the course of their life. Whomever and whatever assures the preservation and extension of such liberties is where my support will remain.
How many times must it be proven [in very real and practical ways], that one's ability to own and protect property - as opposed to the state or its appointees owning it, is the best way to assure the highest level of freedom and prosperity for all? How many broken, bankrupt and murderous regimes must fall before you wake up and smell your own BS? How many thieves will be allowed to run rampant over the property of your neighbors before you realize that respecting the property of others is central to securing respect for your own? Finally, though invited about daily, to speak, write and attend various events, I don't - when I am not working, I am fending off the playful attacks of my sons, their sons, and a pack of kids that take great pleasure in chopping the ole man down like a tree. They refuse to accept that I am old - like really old... and surely, you are sophisticated enough to understand that the support of policy is not the same as endorsing an administration? Your arguments are so often personally directed and weak - lacking substance, that your voice is often too faint to hear at all. |
| #24 By 23275 (24.179.4.158) at 8/22/2007 10:59:53 AM |
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Hey, for alll...
When people say things like, "Well... SD DVD is good enough and or, I won't buy any new format, because of HDCP, etc..." Think for a moment - just a moment.... and ask yourself if you want to enjoy HD DVD/BD content? try it out and let your own enjoyment of the new formats drive what you do, or not. What I mean is really simple: while we in our family and customer base are getting a lot of enjoyment out of Hi-Def [regardless of source and format], others may not be. No sweat. Just don't insist that we should not enjoy the heck out of it - personally, Hi-Def is so much better - so clear and such a better experience, that I will never go back to SD. Same as I won't drive a model-A Ford [my first car] day to day any longer, or "Steam" to Hawaii [flying is faster] and yes, you can surf all your life, I swear it. If people want to stay in the low-speed, high-drag world of SD, fine - let them. Some of us will be kicking it at 1080i/P and loving the ride. If there are rules and equipment requirements?? No problem. There were when many other technologies emerged - radio, FM - oh man, I need a new what?!?!? Electricity? Holy crap, man... ah man, water lines...?!?!? dang, how much is all that and what do you mean I have to allow a hole to be dug? I am amazed at how silly so much of all this is - just amazed. |
| #25 By 2960 (68.100.112.199) at 8/26/2007 4:00:03 AM |
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#16,
I watch mostly HD Cable. The only SD cable I watch are FX, SciFi and USA for the most part. I also watch a lot of DVD's. I have over 600 in my library. I also have the HD DVD player on the XBox. I originally had a MUCH longer post than this, but it got lost when I tried to post it dammit. TL |
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