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Desktop Linux 'will force Microsoft to innovate' | |
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| Time: 12:40 EST/17:40 GMT | News Source: ZDNet UK | Posted By: Robert Stein | ||
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Matt Asay, Novell's director of Linux business office, said on Tuesday at the Linux User and Developer Expo 2004 in London that Linux threatened the proprietory software industry with innovation, rather than extinction, and accused companies such as Microsoft of failing to come up with exciting new applications. "When was the last time that Microsoft Office got significantly better? It's been pretty much the same product for a while now," claimed Asay, speaking at the Linux User and Developer Expo 2004 in London. | ||
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| #1 By 7797 (63.76.44.82) at 4/21/2004 4:05:55 PM |
| Parkker you really are amazing. Why are you so threatened that you feel the constant need to try to defend Microsoft by bashing open sourcce at every opportunity you get? |
| #2 By 3465 (207.98.231.148) at 4/21/2004 4:27:42 PM |
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Hold on.......
............... .............. ............... .............. ............... ............. ............... .............. .............. ............... ............. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Enough said. |
| #3 By 7754 (216.160.8.41) at 4/21/2004 4:59:02 PM |
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"Linux threatened the proprietory [sic] software industry with innovation..."
Actually, Linux threatened proprietary software because of price (at least initial price), and by organizing and capitalizing on a community based on a religious zeal and hatred towards Microsoft. Not innovation. |
| #4 By 7797 (63.76.44.82) at 4/21/2004 6:07:53 PM |
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parkker did you totally loose it?
2 blank posts, one about switching (?) and a third that makes even more sense. Lay off the crack man! |
| #5 By 7754 (216.160.8.41) at 4/21/2004 6:39:56 PM |
| Parkker, honestly, if you keep at it as you have been lately, the reason people will want to switch is YOU. ;) |
| #6 By 7797 (64.244.109.161) at 4/21/2004 10:59:14 PM |
|
first
"What "exciting new applications" does Linux offer for people to switch?" then "I take it you still can't think up a compeeling reason to switch from Windows to Linux." Those are 2 completely seperate things. Some of the exciting new applications are by far not the only reasons some people switch. Anyway, i wouldnt dream of telling you any reasons (or apps) why people switch. I already know it doesnt matter what i could say. You would argue against it just in principle because you perceive me as a OSS fanboy. This post was edited by tgnb on Thursday, April 22, 2004 at 07:30. |
| #7 By 6859 (206.156.242.36) at 4/22/2004 11:44:12 AM |
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I find the whole argument to be flawed that desktop Linux will force MS to innovate.
How, exactly? You mean in the way the Linux desktop innovates by stealing Windows' look, feel, and functionality? Yeah, that's innovation... Perhaps it is the desktop Linux solutions that need to innovate. Ximian is an Outlook/Exchange ripoff. KDE is Windows Explorer with down's syndrome, GNOME is a P.O.S that doesn't really work well. The best things the OSS movement has going for it is OpenOffice.org and Apache. Samba is broken and a P.O.S as well--it just doesn't work. People say they switch from MS to Linux in order to avoid paying the (so called) MS tax...but they avoid nothing, they merely replace the money they pay to MS for a good, functional product with great documentation for a half-broken mess that is a major time-sink with no documentation that is worth while. The absolute best Linux distro documentation is Gentoo's, and even that is pitifully lacking in comparison to one Windows 98 book you can get at a local store. Make no mistake, Linux was based on Minix--because Torvalds couldn't afford his own copy to mess with. Innovation? No, copied. There is nothing Linux can do that I cannot do with a properly configured Windows box at 1/10th the time taken and only marginal cost. Doing the same thing with a Linux solution takes oodles more effort, is flaky (or doesn't work at all), and still requires money in the form of time. Time = Money in the business world. Find me a single OSS product that can duplicate (for free) the ability that Biztalk has and we'll talk. |
| #8 By 19992 (164.214.4.61) at 4/22/2004 1:22:15 PM |
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#14
"I find the whole argument to be flawed that desktop Linux will force MS to innovate. " Right, because when there is competiton in the marketplace it makes alot more sense for the market leader to just sit around and watch their lead slip away. "The best things the OSS movement has going for it is OpenOffice.org and Apache." Take a look at php and MySQL. Pretty slick. "Samba is broken and a P.O.S as well" How so? I'm running Samba on about 700 'servers' over here. Haven't had a single problem and we typically get faster file serves from the UNIX machines as opposed to Windows (2K and 2K3). And no, I'm not running UNIX on a super high end server. I'm talking Sun Ultra 2s vs. Dell Optiplex (GX110) systems here. "Make no mistake, Linux was based on Minix--because Torvalds couldn't afford his own copy to mess with. Innovation? No, copied." I don't think anyone has ever claimed Linux was innovative in a major way. Are there minor innovations (probably the wrong word) in Linux? Sure, just as there are in Windows, neither program has offered a "major" innovation as of yet. "Find me a single OSS product that can duplicate (for free) the ability that Biztalk has and we'll talk. " Not sure if this meets your needs or not (I'm not extremely conversant in BizTalk). http://www.brunswickwdi.com/bie This post was edited by happyguy on Thursday, April 22, 2004 at 14:27. |
| #9 By 7797 (63.76.44.82) at 4/22/2004 4:05:51 PM |
|
"I find the whole argument to be flawed that desktop Linux will force MS to innovate.
How, exactly? You mean in the way the Linux desktop innovates by stealing Windows' look, feel, and functionality? Yeah, that's innovation..." No. Microsoft will be forced to innovate because Linux is catching up to MS look feel and functionality very fast. MS will innovate because they will not sit by idle and watch linux surpass them in look feel and functionality! How is this argument flawed? "Perhaps it is the desktop Linux solutions that need to innovate." I guess before they can innovate they need to catch up. And they are .. at a pretty fast rate! "Samba is broken and a P.O.S as well--it just doesn't work." Speak for yourself. Plenty of people feel quite differently about that. They MUST be wrong since you are very experienced with Samba obviously! "People say they switch from MS to Linux in order to avoid paying the (so called) MS tax...but they avoid nothing, they merely replace the money they pay to MS for a good, functional product with great documentation for a half-broken mess that is a major time-sink with no documentation that is worth while. The absolute best Linux distro documentation is Gentoo's, and even that is pitifully lacking in comparison to one Windows 98 book you can get at a local store." Yet for some strange reason people are using Linux anyway and some are even switching to it from windows. They must all be crazy. If YOU cant find the reason why they would do that then NOBODY CAN! "Make no mistake, Linux was based on Minix--because Torvalds couldn't afford his own copy to mess with. Innovation? No, copied." No one has argued that he innovated although you are incorrect that it was based on minix because he couldn't afford his own copy to mess with. "WHAT IS MINIX 2.0 MINIX is a free UNIX clone that is available with all the source code." http://www.cs.vu.nl/~ast/minix.html#whatisminix Shows how much you really know! (or don't) "There is nothing Linux can do that I cannot do with a properly configured Windows box at 1/10th the time taken and only marginal cost." Hahaha maybe you can't think of anything. Other people can. Why is google using Linux? because it costs more and it takes them longer to be productive? Oh yeah .. that must be why! |
| #10 By 19992 (69.170.7.187) at 4/22/2004 4:43:46 PM |
|
#16 Correct the Ultra 2s are on SCSI, however, it's only Ultra SCSI, it's not like I'm on an Ultra320 with 15K RPM drives, and my system CPUs only have 1MB of cache (not 2)
Systems are generally as follows (there are some variations over the systems): Sun Ultra 2 Single 200MHz CPU (I have no 300 or 400MHz CPUs) 512MB RAM 1 9.1Gb Ultra SCSI HDD (5400RPM) 10/100 NIC Dell Optiplex GX110 Single Intel P3 866MHz 512MB RAM 20GB 7200RPM HDD 10/100 NIC Not a major difference in the hardware. Although, the Dell feels more responsive when sitting in front of it. |
| #11 By 135 (209.180.28.6) at 4/22/2004 5:56:17 PM |
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Linux has it's place.
Just not in my house. |
| #12 By 9589 (68.17.52.2) at 4/22/2004 6:06:33 PM |
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Happyguy, there is a major price difference between the Sun Ultra 2 and the Dell Optiplex GX100. We used to use this model of the Sun server as firewalls at an original cost of around $26k (maybe this is one of the reasons McSqueally is having so much trouble making any money lately - he can no longer get away with selling his overpriced hardware). The Dell was originally priced at about $2k and below that after typical corporate discounts.
Meanwhile, I too am thinking of the exciting new applications that are built on the Linux operating system - Hold on....... ............... .............. ............... .............. ............... ............. ............... .............. .............. ............... ............. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Enough said. |
| #13 By 19992 (69.170.7.187) at 4/22/2004 7:58:40 PM |
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jdhawk
Irrelevant. I never claimed that Sun hardware was a better buy than an X86 based system. My example was/is intended to highlight that even running on a machine that is 8 years old Samba outperfroms Windows on a box that is half its age. "Meanwhile, I too am thinking of the exciting new applications that are built on the Linux operating system " When did I make a statement of that nature? Please show me where I said that, otherwise direct your comment to the appropriate source. |
| #14 By 7797 (64.244.109.161) at 4/22/2004 8:04:55 PM |
|
"I think bringing up google in a discussion about Desktop Linux is kind of silly. Most people do not run a search engine from their desktop."
I brought up google in response to: "There is nothing Linux can do that I cannot do with a properly configured Windows box at 1/10th the time taken and only marginal cost." He didnt mention a desktop .... |
| #15 By 21055 (67.34.14.160) at 4/22/2004 10:43:15 PM |
| i speak as a humble XP home user, not as a professional as most of you seem to be...but i can't help but feel that ANY competition is good. Microsoft seems to get better when it feels a little heat behind it. i'm still waiting for a "killer app" version of linux that'll be worth the time and trouble of learning another OS. flame me if you will, but i'd still like to see something make MS be a little less complacent about the home user. |
| #16 By 9589 (68.17.52.2) at 4/23/2004 1:18:53 AM |
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happyguy, you are absolutely postively right - comparing a server that cost 13 times more than a workstation has nothing to do whatsoever with your argument. I stand corrected. Shame on me (I am kicking myself while you are reading this).
Meanwhile, I am STILL thinking of all the exciting new applications that are built on the Linux operating system - Hold on....... ............... .............. ............... .............. ............... ............. ............... .............. .............. ............... ............. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Enough said. |
| #17 By 19992 (164.214.4.32) at 4/23/2004 8:24:59 AM |
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jdhawk
First, who said I paid 26K for the Sun workstations? Second, I never claimed that going out a spending 26K on a Sun vs. spending 2K on a Dell for the exact same purpose is a wise idea. Third, have you ever heard of depreciation? The Sun systems are no longer worth 26K, in fact on the books over here they are now worth less than the Dell systems. So the Optiplex (as far as my budget is concerned) costs more than the Sun Ultra 2 systems (which costs me nothing for the HW each year). Since you can't seem to grasp the concepts of depreciation, why don't we try comparing SAMBA vs. Windows on the exact same HW platform? Sorry, been done already. SAMBA wins. It has beaten Windows 2000 and Windows 2003 in performance on the EXACT same hardware for the past 4 years or so. "Meanwhile, I am STILL thinking of all the exciting new applications that are built on the Linux operating system -" Since you can't seem to show me where I ever made a comment to lead you to address this to me, I'll have to assume that you are just randomly copying and pasting. |
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