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Adobe Gets Ready To Rumble With Microsoft | |
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| Time: 13:26 EST/18:26 GMT | News Source: InformationWeek | Posted By: Robert Stein | ||
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Adobe Systems Inc. is making changes to Acrobat that could mean lower desktop licensing costs for many businesses but higher prices for design and engineering users. Upcoming workflow technology from Microsoft, however, could give some users an alternative to Adobe's document software. Acrobat 6, the latest version of Adobe's software for creating and editing industry-standard PDF documents, will come in three editions when it ships in May. A light edition for volume licensing will likely cost less than $50 per user, a standard version is expected to run about $250 (the same as Acrobat 5), and a professional package aimed at graphic-arts and engineering users could exceed $450, according to sources. Adobe wouldn't confirm pricing. | ||
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| #1 By 7754 (216.160.8.41) at 3/31/2003 2:57:32 PM |
| Am I alone in thinking that these products don't really directly compete with each other? |
| #2 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 3/31/2003 5:04:01 PM |
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bluvg, the distinction I would point out is that while Acrobat is already substantially ahead of InfoPath as a datastore/form system, its primary purpose is as a universally usable file format that is capable of preserving high quality readability/printability... i.e. it's the paperless "paper document" format. This is really the feature set that InfoPath created docs will lack, but MS should really be able to exploit the data collection/storage functionality of InfoPath over the "document"-centric PDF. This post was edited by sodajerk on Monday, March 31, 2003 at 19:49. |
| #3 By 6859 (206.156.242.36) at 3/31/2003 5:05:56 PM |
| Damn, Sodajerk, that was an excellent explanation. |
| #4 By 7754 (216.160.8.41) at 3/31/2003 5:20:46 PM |
| That's what I've always thought about it, sodajerk... that's why I am a bit confused why these products are cast as competition to each other. PDF has an emphasis on output integrity; InfoPath has an emphasis of being output-agnostic, in a sense. One is output-oriented, the other is input-oriented. |
| #5 By 7754 (216.160.8.41) at 3/31/2003 6:05:04 PM |
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That's true, stubear, but I guess I just haven't seen it done to any great extent. Maybe it's more of a perception problem than anything. The "interactive" forms I've seen have not allowed you to save your information, but only allow you to print. Anyone seen PDF forms used heavily as interactive data gatherers?
I guess in a way, then, a possible advantage of InfoPath is that it is output-agnostic in a sense--you can format the output in pretty much any way you want. I suppose the form information entered into a PDF form as XML could be formatted for output in any way desired as well, but maybe there's more flexibility in how the form can be offered? This post was edited by bluvg on Monday, March 31, 2003 at 18:22. |
| #6 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 3/31/2003 6:23:31 PM |
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"heavily"? No, but my company has implemented some PDF Forms as a data store.... The whole issue is whether or not you are familiar with using the full suite of Acrobat products (which most people aren't--at least the functionality of it.) This includes server products too--though I'm less familiar with them... We've got a simple setup because we do interactive GIS maps via the web and have built a system to create nice, high quality printable map output using PDF. (Completely different situation, but my point is that just because you haven't been exposed to it doesn't mean that PDF hasn't already established a considerable position.)
"I guess in a way, then, a possible advantage of InfoPath is that it is output-agnostic in a sense--you can format the output in pretty much any way you want." You could also say this is a weakness. Even though we don't have excesive PDF workflows at my company we do have a fair percentage of our contracts in wholly electronic format (w/ digital certs, etc...). In this case, a lot of the information that is stored is still dependent on a "paper" original--a verifiable and legally-binding document. My suspicion is that InfoPath can't really accomplish this--which can be a problem as it's a source of duplication if some other format needs to be preserved as well. |
| #7 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 3/31/2003 7:19:59 PM |
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By the way, implicit in the above post was the fact that the data CAN be extracted from Acrobat forms and used in any output you desire. In fact, it's postscript--depending on your expertise and the source of the files, even the non-form-inputted data can largely be "extracted."
So, No to: "I guess in a way, then, a possible advantage of InfoPath is that it is output-agnostic in a sense." It is not entirely a true advantage... it may be somewhat easier, but only in the sense that you have someone with knowledge of XML and VS at work who can do this--if not, not really at all. Of course, some of this (the ease and flexibility of InfoPath) is speculative on my part. |
| #8 By 7754 (209.98.24.241) at 3/31/2003 10:00:17 PM |
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Sodajerk, that sounds pretty cool what you guys are doing. Most of the content I've seen in PDF has been print related (advertising company), manuals, tax forms ;), and legal documents and forms. Are the PDF forms you guys make themselves interactive? My understanding of what you said is that the web app is the interactive part, but the forms themselves are static Postscript.
I see what you mean that you could extract the Postscript information, but that's not really the same as XML for that purpose. I thought the idea behind XML is that it was getting embraced by much of the industry, so it should play well with many systems for data interchange (if you did what you are suggesting with Postscript, wouldn't that be kind of defeating the purpose of the PDF format?). I think that could be an advantage of InfoPath. That can be an advantage, or it might not be, depending on the situation. I still see them as quite different in that regard, which is why I don't really see them as direct competitors. There may be some overlap, but it seems like they're addressing different tasks. As with you, though, this is my speculation... I'm definitely not an expert on either product, so maybe I should keep my mouth shut.... :) |
| #9 By 2459 (24.170.151.19) at 3/31/2003 10:07:11 PM |
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You guys can find out more about InfoPath (including a Flash demo and usage scenarios) here:
http://www.microsoft.com/office/preview/infopath/default.asp Also an FAQ here: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/prodtechnol/office/office2003/plan/inpthfaq.asp RE: InfoPath and Digital Originals From FAQ: Q: Can I make a pixel perfect form to match my paper form? A: Electronic forms provide an inherent advantage over paper forms by making it easier for people to fill out the form. The goal of InfoPath is to make it easier for users to gather and provide information and to ensure that the information being captured is correct. As such, InfoPath is optimized to add a familiar document editing experience to the world of forms. Providing the ability to achieve pixel perfect forms to match paper forms is not an end-goal for InfoPath. Unlike many form creation programs, InfoPath uses a table metaphor to make it easier to lay out the form and optimize it for the computer screen. That being said, if your scenario requires the electronic form to be similar to the paper form, the table model that InfoPath supports will allow you to generate a very close match. |
| #10 By 2459 (24.170.151.19) at 3/31/2003 10:13:29 PM |
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Also, with the aid of a TabletPC or digital input pad, you can keep your documents fully electronic and have a person sign the electronic form which is legaly binding. I don't know if any of the public scenarios show this, but it was shown with a .NET Windows Form app, IIRC, during the Microsoft Presentation at the recent mobility conference.
http://www.microsoft.com/winme/0303/20282/ctia_300k.asx (300k WMV File) Transcript and 110k file here: http://www.microsoft.com/billgates/speeches/2003/03-19mdc.asp Demo Starts around 25:30 This post was edited by n4cer on Monday, March 31, 2003 at 22:16. |
| #11 By 3339 (65.198.47.10) at 4/1/2003 2:36:22 PM |
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bluvg, no, I'm not directly involved with the project (its an HR-related thing) but from what I know the forms are dumping the data to a SQL (maybe Access) database at the same time the PDFs are generated for HR's records.
I wasn't suggesting that the only way to pull data out of PDFs is to pull the Postscript--I was just adding that because I have seen that too--and that was all automated by scripts. |
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